[...] of all, I linked to the discussion on Parchment and Pen. The fact of the matter is, the discussion got shut down. That should tell you something right [...]

Cheryl. Very good point. I agree. With that, let us close this one down.

Hodge,

Even if I were to accept the interpretation of the verses in I John above, which I am not sure that I do, it would still seem a pretty big leap to me to think that birth control is committing murder. Unless, of course, it is one of the types that acts as an abortificant. After all, how does one kill a person that does not even exist yet?

1 John 3:11 For this is the message which you have heard from the beginning, that we should love one another; 12 not as Cain , [who] was of the evil one and slew his brother. And for what reason did he slay him? Because his deeds were evil, and his brother’s were righteous. 13 Do not be surprised, brethren, if the world hates you. 14 We know that we have passed out of death into life, because we love the brethren. He who does not love abides in death.
15 Everyone who hates his brother is a murderer; and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him. 16 We know love by this, that He laid down His life for us; and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren. 17 But whoever has the world’s goods, and sees his brother in need and closes his heart against him, how does the love of God abide in him? 18 Little children, let us not love with word or with tongue, but in deed and truth.

Notice that love is in laying down one’s life that another might be preserved, giving physical supplies to those who are in need. Remember that the word “hate” refers to apathy in Scripture, not always hostility (and John seems to be playing off that here), so the one who is apathetic toward his brother’s needy condition is a murderer like Cain.
My point, of course, is that murder in God’s eyes is not always in the same form that we often imagine it. We usually limit it to a specific deed, but there is a greater morality that dictates the evil of the act that lay behind it.

Bill B,

You said, “Sexual immorality – if you’re contracepting so you can engage in sex without consequences, without the obligations to your partner that are entailed in that, then you are using your spouse as an object, and that is immoral.”

I assume you are speaking of married people here. It seems to me that I Corinthians 7:1-9 directly contradicts this idea.

Hodge,

Where does John say that not to give to a brother in need is murder and that person is a murder like Cain?

And are there other Scriptures that this idea comes from also?

“I believe that God was pretty explicit in what He defined as sin. He spelled it out in the Ten Commandments and in some other places in the Bible. I don’t seem to recall contraception in any list of sins. If contraception is sin, why was God not explicit in describing it as such?”

Steve,

Do you believe any actions that are not explicitly prescribed in the Bible are sins?

BTW, the Ten Commandments don’t contain everything that is moral or immoral in their explicit statements. I think our Lord draws out the implications of the law in His hermeneutic in Matt 5-7 in order to teach us that we are to expand the Word of God to reign over every area of our lives. The Pharisees did not do this. Hence, they thought they were without sin in these specific areas because they did not explicitly break these commandments. Christ points out that there is a morality behind the explicit statements of the law that reaches into every aspect of our theology and ethics.

Just to clarify on the “form of murder” issue:

The Fathers, as well as the Scripture from which they draw, views anti-creational sins as forms of murder. In other words, things that flow toward chaos and hinder or reverse the flow of creation and order (i.e., human life) are considered forms of murder because they do not work with God toward the procreation, perpetuation and preservation of human life. This is why John says that not saving the life of a fellow Christian who is in need (i.e., that which he needs to preserve his life) is murder, and the one who does not love his brother as to give to him life-preserving supplies is a murderer like Cain. I just wanted to make clear that their view of the act is not as absurd as it may first sound.

Well, sure, someone can summarize the position against abortion in a few sentences. That wasn’t my point. My point is that in a culture that does not think abortion is wrong, and it is absurd to suggest otherwise (as it is in the more liberal European cultures), this summary can be easily dismissed without consideration.

1. Killing human beings is sin according to the Bible.

They would say they agree.

2. At some point either either at conception or before birth the fetus becomes a human being.

This is your opinion. Some people don’t view the baby as human until the birth. So if I were one of those people, I would dismiss your point already.

3. The exact moment of becoming human is not completely clear from the Bible though some evidence such as the Law’s punishment for causing a woman to miscarry indicate that it is almost certainly before birth and likely closer to conception.

Actually, the economic justice of the Deuteronomic law code only indicates that the family has lost a possible future economic benefit to it in the loss of a pregnancy. This says nothing to the issue of when a fetus becomes a human. Economic justice is also imposed for those who’s bodily members are harmed. This does not mean that bodily members are human beings.

4. Because we do not and cannot know the exact moment in a pregnancy the developing child becomes a human abortion should not be practiced less we kill another human being.

Because we do not and cannot know the exact moment in a pregnancy the developing fetus becomes a human, and God didn’t care enough to speak against abortion when we would need to know if it was wrong due to our limited knowledge, no one should bind others with his or her personal view of when a fetus becomes a human. Ergo, no one should speak absolutely about abortion being wrong for any reason.

Now, you can argue with these; but I think it proves my point that anything can be easily dismissed. I think another interesting discussion is the one concerning pedophilia, as this has become a growing issue in some cultures. I would argue similarly against it with much of the same arguments I’ve used against contraceptive practices, but I’m not sure how a culture that adopts all of the views concerning the uses of the sexual act can forever stay the hand of a growing depravity, unless the underlying assumptions are answered sufficiently.

It has been brought to my attention that this post has spiraled out of control and people are not handling themselve maturely. I have not had access the the internet for a while so I am not sure.

I may have time later to check it out.

Please, go out of your way to be respectful and respectable. If not, we will have to ban you from posting.