Can Christians Support Abortion? A Theology of Abortion

Recent polls indicate that the majority of Americans are pro-choice with regards to abortion. This is interesting considering that similar polls tell us that the majority of Americans identify themselves as Christians. This begs the question, Can a Christian support abortion?
Without getting into any of the medical details of or even physiological reasons for abortions (for I am not a physician or a physiologist), I would like to deal with the issue from a purely theological standpoint. Where one stands on abortion, I submit, has more to do with one’s theology than they realize.
Should Christians support abortion? I submit that Christian theology, practically speaking, has no such allowances. UPDATE: This is not the same as asking can one be a Christian and support abortion. This is most certianly possible. But this is focused upon Christian theology. Can there be a Christian theology that allows for abortion? I don’t believe so.
The theological issues of abortion are not spoken of or understood much today, yet the implications are significant. The question that one must ask with regards to this issue is this: When does the soul/spirit (immaterial aspect; henceforth soul) join with the physical (the material aspect) of a person? This is often referred to as a debate about the constitution of man. If the soul is part of the physical body from conception, then abortion is out of the question. The person is a complete person, material and immaterial, from the beginning and has not only divine recognition, but a divine mandate for life. Any premature cessation of this life by an outside agent would amount to murder. But if there is a time when the unborn is without a soul, then, during this time, the fetus is not a person, but simply an extension of the mother’s physical nature.
The question is, when does the body receive the soul?
There are two positions that have been represented prominently throughout church history and it is with these two I would like to wrestle.
1. Creationism: The belief that the soul is created directly by God and “inserted” into or united with the body. The body, on the other hand, is created indirectly by God through the parents. Notice the difference. One is created directly by God, the other indirectly by God. Another way to put it is that the soul is created immediately by God, while the body is created mediately by man.
This position has significant support in contemporary and historic theology. Noteworthy adherents to this position include Wayne Grudem, Charles Hodge, Louis Berkholf, John Calvin, and surprisingly enjoys the support of most Roman Catholics. The basic defense for this position is that God, the father of all spirits (Heb. 12:9), is the only agent that can create an immaterial entity. Kind gives forth to kind. Man is physical and can only birth physical. Therefore, God must have created the soul directly, outside any mediating agency of man.
2. Traducianism (from the Latin tradux meaning “inheritance or transmission”): This is the belief that while God is the ultimate creator of all things, He uses secondary causes to bring them into existence. If God ceased from creation after the sixth day and is no longer creating ex nihilo (out of nothing), then all creation since the sixth day is initiated mediately through secondary causes, including the soul.
To put the matter plainly, parents are just as involved in the creation of the soul as they are the body. God does not use special process for the creation of the soul. The basic defense of this position is focused on the negative implications of the creationist position. If God creates the souls directly, without the mediating support of humanity, how does one explain the inherent sinfulness of the soul? If people are born with a fallen sinful nature (Ps. 51:5), how did the soul become corrupt? Did God create a sinful soul and place it in a sinful body? Can God create something impure? Traducianists are quick to charge the creationist with making God directly responsible for sin.
Most importantly, the traducianist does not elevate the value of the soul above that of the body. Therefore, a traducianist believes that the soul/spirit is created in and with the body. Their is not two acts, but one. Traducianism is not without it support. Noteworthy traducianists are Tertullian, Martian Luther, Jonathan Edward, and Millard Erickson.
Now, back to the topic of abortion. Theologically speaking, it is impossible for there to be a Christian traducianist who supports abortion. Why? Because the traducianist’s theology precludes a necessary belief that a person is complete from the moment of conception. There can never be a time when the child is without a soul. The parents provide the soul at the same time and in the same way as they provide the body. When there is a zygote, there is a soul.
A creationist, on the other hand, has what, at first, seems to be a slight crack in the door. Why? Because no one can say with any amount of certainty when the body is united with the soul. Is it at conception? Implantation? During the first, second, or third trimester? At birth? Or even sometime after birth like the age of accountability? However, a deferment to ignorance is a necessary recourse for the creationist. Why? Because they do not know when the soul is united to the body. Therefore most assume that any abortion is probably killing a complete person. This is why theologians who are creationists are against abortion.
I am a traducianist. Not because I seek a solid theological stand against abortion, but because I believe that it is the best option that deals most comprehensively with the biblical data and a systematic Christian worldview. I believe that the creationist view (which is the most prominent and popular among laity) assumes an unjustified stance concerning the relationship of the body and the soul. There is no reason to say that the soul is of special nature which must be created directly by God.
This line of thinking (that the soul must be created directly by God) evidences what I believe to be Gnostic influences. Gnosticism was a first-century Greek philosophy that crept into Christianity here and there, and still plagues our thinking at the most fundamental levels. Gnostics were dualists, believing that all things material were essentially evil, while all things spiritual were essentially good. For a Gnostic, the ultimate goal was for one to escape the confinement of the material body, finding fulfillment in the spiritual existence.
But the Christian worldview is just the opposite. Christianity affirms the essential goodness of all creation, even though it has been infected with sin. Our goal is not to escape the physical world, but to sanctify it. God declared all things good at creation. All that was involved in this declaration was the physical world, including man’s physical nature. When man sinned, God did not cast aside His original intent opting for a “plan B,” but immediately began the process of redeeming the world that He created. When people die, there is an unnatural breach in their personhood, separating the immaterial (soul)Â from the material (body), but this does not suggest that the immaterial soul is somehow better or more highly favored in God’s eyes than the body. In fact, the consummation of redemption comes at the resurrection of the body, when the soul is reunited with the physical body and the new heavens and new earth (material) are created.
This Gnostic disdain for the physicality has unfortunately found its way into Christianity in many ways. In the early Church sex was seen as a necessary evil rather than a beautiful creation of God. Monasticism was highly valued thinking that the pleasures of this world were all evil. People have seen culture and government as evil because they are part of this world. The Bible is seen as a book of God to the neglect of the contribution of man (this has had great repercussions hermeneutically). Finally, I believe the Church has devalued the body and elevated the soul, believing that while man can create the body, only God can create the soul. There is no reason for this. They are both equally miraculous.
I believe that the traducianist theory answers the questions of anthropology better than the creationist viewpoint. While their are many good Christians, contemporary and throughout church history, who have held to the creationist view, I believe that they are wrong.
In short, I believe the issue of abortion is a theological issue. I believe that whether you are a creationist or traducianist, you should not support abortion. It must be seen as a violation of the fifth commandment which negatively says “You shall not murder” but positively says, “You shall protect life.” Sadly, I believe, this understanding escapes the forefront of the debate because so many in the church today have relegated theology to a seat of irrelevance and impracticality.
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- Can Christians Support Abortion? A Theology of Abortion
- Can a Christian Support Abortion? The Theology of Abortion
- The Thing Itself – Consequences of the Abortion Debate
- Converse with Scholars: Defending Life - Francis Beckwith on Abortion
- My controversial view of Conditional Monism

Truth Unites... and Divides on 04 Mar 2008 at 7:46 pm #
Can Christians Support Abortion? A Theology of Abortion
“I believe that whether you are a creationist or traducianist, you cannot support abortion.”
I agree with you. The answer is NO.
The difficult and more challenging question is this. How do you pastorally-polemically communicate with professing Christians who do support abortion?
There are a good number of liberal mainline Christians who support abortion. I’ve read of an Episcopalian priestess who’s had an abortion and supports other women in having abortions. There is a group of liberal Christians called “Religious Coalition for Reproductive Choice” who adamantly support abortion.
The question remains: How do you pastorally-polemically communicate with professing Christians who do support abortion?
dan on 04 Mar 2008 at 8:14 pm #
“I agree with you. The answer is NO.
The difficult and more challenging question is this. How do you pastorally-polemically communicate with professing Christians who do support abortion?”
Not by YELLING at them, especially if they are well-educated. An MDiv will not be impressive to the doctor or lawyer, or in my case the ABD in Biblical Studies from an Ivy-League school.
I’m a Christian and I support abortion. Arguing along dogmatic lines to someone more clever than you won’t get you anywhere. Prooftexting scripture to someone who knows the Bible better isn’t helpful. It’ll be amusing but that’s it.
Try using language like “I believe” or “I feel” or “have you thought” and I’ll treat you as a person rather than as an overly dogmatic and somewhat uninformed argument.
That’s how you’d communicate to well-educated liberal Christians if you want to know. Speak as a pastor rather than as a (poor) polemicist.
Jugulum on 04 Mar 2008 at 8:15 pm #
The question remains: How do you pastorally-polemically communicate with professing Christians who do support abortion?
A smack upside the head?
Jugulum on 04 Mar 2008 at 8:19 pm #
Try using language like “I believe†or “I feel†or “have you thought†and I’ll treat you as a person rather than as an overly dogmatic and somewhat uninformed argument.
Looks like a false dilemma to me.
There are ways to avoid yelling without prefacing each remark with the hesitancy of “This is my opinion”.
Edited to add: Mind you, I’m sure that you could find some examples of people arguing badly–yelling, perfunctory, shallow proof-texting, etc. But your stated criterion for treating people “as a person rather than as an overly dogmatic and somewhat uninformed argument” is peculiar.
C Michael Patton on 04 Mar 2008 at 8:27 pm #
Truth, I would say that we never “pastorally-polemically” communicate such issues—at least not if you want to gain an audience. If you want to preach to those who normally already agree, that may be the way.
I think we have to inform people of the issues as best we can. Most people don’t think through these issues of when life begins and equate it to when the soul is part of the constitution. Normally they judge the presence of the soul scientifically. But science has nothing definitive to say about when the soul is present.
I think that theology needs to have a stronger voice. This requires educating people of the issues so that they can make a more informed decision.
Truth Unites... and Divides on 04 Mar 2008 at 9:37 pm #
I’m a Christian and I support abortion.
Dan, I greatly appreciate the honesty and clarity.
A Reform apologist provided me this counsel regarding pastoral and polemical communication:
“Apologetics has a polemical edge. That’s the nature of the beast.
Otherwise reasonable people can be committed to an irrational belief-system like Islam or Mormonism or atheism or Catholicism. As a result, they resort to bad arguments. There are no good arguments for falsehood.
What frequently happens, though, is that a person will sound fairly reasonable at first, but as his objections are shot down, one-by-one, the quality of his argumentation quickly deteriorates.
That also brings us to a difference between pastoral theology and polemical theology. If, say, an unbeliever launches a public attack on the Christian faith, we have a right to unsparingly attack his position.
If, however, I had a face-to-face conversation with someone who is expressing his doubts about the faith, that demands an entirely different approach.
There are also Christians who have a preconception of Christian etiquette which has no solid basis in Scripture. It’s like the parody of the Christian “gentlemen†in Victorian novels. A novel of manners.
Finally, I do not tolerate professing believers who hide behind their Christian profession as a shield to excuse their shoddy or unscriptural arguments. I do not expect people to give my arguments a free pass because I claim to be a Christian, and I hold them to the same standard of intellectual probity.”
Dan, I’m easier going than this Reform apologist. This blog is probably not the forum for an in-depth discussion of abortion. It would probably be intense. I’m up to it, but most people aren’t.
BTW, your ABD is nothing to me. If you knew who I’ve had discussions with before, you’d know that I’m very unimpressed with people who trot out their “credentials” as if that gives them a free pass to espouse nonsense.
“I’m a Christian and I support abortion.”
To sum up, you’re a professing Christian, and on this issue, you’re erring. Erring badly. And in this case, I think being polemic is being pastoral. (Yes, this is an assertion, not an argument …. because you’ve read Scripture, and I assume that you’ve read pro-life arguments before, not to mention that you read CMP’s argument above. Why repeat arguments that you’re already familiar with?)
Let’s simply agree to disagree agreeably. Pax.
Eric W on 04 Mar 2008 at 9:55 pm #
What is the “soul”? There are a couple verses in the New Testament that may distinguish “soul” from “spirit” (and “body”) - Hebrew 4:12 and 1 Thessalonians 5:23, and maybe 3 John 2, depending on how you want to translate psyche - but that seems to be it, at least on the face of things.
In the Old Testament, the word(s) for “soul” - nephesh and neshamah primarily, I believe (and they also can mean “breath” - Wm. Holladay Concise Lexicon) - meant more or something different than what we commonly mean by “soul.” The word(s) often seemed to stand for the whole person, not the immaterial “spiritual” or “mind/will/emotion” part of man.
When did our concept of “soul” arise, and from where did it arise? Did the concept/meaning evolve in the Scriptures from simply meaning “a person” (”and man became a living soul”) to meaning the inner volitional or spiritual nature (”Bless the LORD, O my soul, and all that is within me bless His holy name”)?
As more and more studies show that drugs, hormones, brain damage, accidents, Alzheimer’s disease, etc., can erase or totally change what a person was before the incident or onset of the change, who or what is the “soul”? What is the Christian definition, and when and how and on what texts or theology does this definition rely?
I have heard statements or questions about when God puts the “soul” in the fetus or zygote or whatever. Is that what Christians believe happens?
Or is the “soul” a physical thing, formed when the two sets of 23 chromosomes join? Does each set of chromosomes have “soul”?
If it’s not a physical thing, why is what we consider a person (or “soul”) to be something that, as I noted, can be erased or changed by accidents or disease or bodily disorder? If that part can disappear, leaving a body that acts and thinks and wills and feels and behaves quite differently than it did before the incident or change, has the “soul” changed?
I’m not being facetious. I don’t think we can use terms like “soul” with respect to this topic (i.e., abortion) unless we know what those terms mean.
And if we are ever able to achieve viable human cloning, then what are we going to say makes a humanoid a person/human?
Truth Unites... and Divides on 04 Mar 2008 at 10:16 pm #
CMP: “Can a Christian support abortion? I submit that Christian theology, practically speaking, has no such allowances.”
CMP: “I believe that whether you are a creationist or traducianist, you cannot support abortion.”
Dan: “I’m a Christian and I support abortion.â€
Clarity is good.
Minnowspeaks on 04 Mar 2008 at 10:22 pm #
This is truly a silly question unless you are saying someone can be “saved” but not be a Christian. You must also narrowly define Christian to include only those people who believe abortion is murder and because it is murder accepting abortion as a “right” disqualifies you from being a Christian.
CMP–I’m disappointed. This feels very much like just one more way to separate the thems from the us-es. And for what purpose?
JoanieD on 04 Mar 2008 at 10:29 pm #
Eric, good questions about the soul. I have wondered myself about this. I am reading N.T. Wright’s book “Surprised by Hope” and though he was greatly influenced by C.S. Lewis, he thinks Lewis got it wrong about the soul. He doesn’t go much beyond that, but I am not done with the book either. I lean toward humans BEING a soul, as in the soul IS the personality of the person, that which makes the person unique. And I wonder like you do too about what happens to the soul, the personality, the person after a brain disease or some other kind of disorder. Does the person become a different person? Have they “lost their soul”, lost their personality? Is the REAL person somehow “stuck” inside and unable to communicate? When we die and before we are given resurrection bodies, what IS it that is conscious of being in the presence of God? Is that our soul? If so, what is it really? All those questions do have an impact on what we may think about abortion so we are not going completely “off topic.” (OK, maybe just a little.)
Joanie D.
C Michael Patton on 04 Mar 2008 at 11:06 pm #
Good points guys. Thanks for bringing up. I changed my title to “Should Christians Support Abortion.” I thought about that, but it seemed less provocative.
But your comments are well taken. Can a Christian support abortion? Yes, obviously.
C Michael Patton on 04 Mar 2008 at 11:11 pm #
The traducian viewpoint is that a person is a soul and a body, we do not have a soul and body.
While they are necessarily distinguished through death, they were not meant to be separated. Death is a breach in the humanity of a person in the deepest sense. That is why the resurrection itself must take place before judgment. God does not judge an incomplete person.
Therefore, the soul is only known because of death…it would not even be distinguished otherwise. It is a part of who we are at the most essential level and connected so vitally to the material that there is no way to separate the attributes of each. When the soul hurt, the body hurts. When the body is damaged, the soul is damaged.
This is also called “conditional unity.” Millard Erickson has done some good work on this.
donsands on 04 Mar 2008 at 11:43 pm #
Nice photo on your post. How old is that baby?
I have a video that shows a beautiful baby like this, torn apart. A picture can be worth a thousand words sometimes.
Jesus is our soul, and we are His Body. “I am crucified with Christ, yet I live, but not I, but Christ in me”.
A mystery to me, but I believe this with all my heart, because He made me believe.
Seth R. on 04 Mar 2008 at 11:45 pm #
Traducianism still doesn’t answer the question of why an undeveloped soul-body combination (early fetus) is to be valued the same as a developed soul-body combination (say - a one year old infant). Why does the mere presence of some stage of the soul mandate the “murder” classification?
C Michael Patton on 04 Mar 2008 at 11:51 pm #
Seth, I don’t understand your comment. Why would the stage development play a part? If the soul is in a less developed state, why would it be any less of a soul? Or a person?
C Michael Patton on 05 Mar 2008 at 12:07 am #
I changed it back, but you guys are right. Obviously Christians can support abortion, but my argument is simply that it is an unChristian support.
Luke on 05 Mar 2008 at 12:08 am #
Truth,
There is a way to get your point across without saying the things you say with such an arrogant tone.
Truth Unites... and Divides on 05 Mar 2008 at 12:56 am #
Luke: “Though Republicans are generally pro-life, they are extremely corrupt when it comes to many other issues (e.g. insurance, healthcare, oil, environment, greed, etc). As I said in an earlier post, just because a party is pro-life doesn’t mean they will do anything to overturn Roe v Wade…and in the Republicans case, they haven’t. I have simply lost all hope in Republicans.”
Luke, there is a way to get your point across without saying the things you say with such arrogant, condescending, and insulting verbiage.
Truth Unites... and Divides on 05 Mar 2008 at 1:00 am #
Dan: “I’m a Christian and I support abortion.â€
CMP: “Obviously Christians can support abortion, but my argument is simply that it is an unChristian support.”
Is that argument agreeable to you Dan?
Truth Unites... and Divides on 05 Mar 2008 at 1:53 am #
Luke,
I would have to agree with Marvin the Martian’s assessment of you in the other abortion thread. He wrote:
“I also question the intellectual honesty of one who can character assassinate an entire party and everyone who supports it in one broad stroke while ignoring the corruption that is equally rife on your own side of the aisle.”
Luke, you have a large plank in your eye when you judge and accuse others of having an arrogant tone.
Aaron on 05 Mar 2008 at 2:07 am #
I think the more timely, practical question is whether or not abortion becomes the only issue that is relevant from a voter standpoint. I know many Christians who flatly refuse to vote for politicians if they are pro-choice, no matter what. However, I think a little more thoughtful discretion is necessary when making that choice. Especially when considering the politician’s ability/willingness to actually affect the type of change that Christians are looking for.
As for my opinion, the only tenable position I see to be pro-abortion would be a creationist who believes the soul enters the body at or after delivery. Even then, Christians have historically been anti-abortion since early Roman times and it’s difficult to see how any pro-abortion stance falls in line with biblical teaching.
Even from a non-Christian perspective people don’t have much of a leg to stand on. Most arguments for abortion either revolve around loose ethical reasoning or the over-abused, generally outdated ‘health of the mother’ argument.
bethyada on 05 Mar 2008 at 3:10 am #
Traducianism is not without it support. Noteworthy traducianists are Tertullian, Martian Luther, Jonathan Edward, and Millard Erickson.
My question is:
Was Martian Luther that guy who brought the Reformation to the rest of the planets in the solar system?
historic salve on 05 Mar 2008 at 3:13 am #
I disagree that the fetus is only an extension of the mother if it does not have a spirit. The spirit is merely the animating principle of the body. We have to be careful not to talk about it as if it’s the “real” part of a person.
bethyada on 05 Mar 2008 at 3:21 am #
Michael, I am not so certain about your conclusions for traducianists.
The parents make the body and the soul. Mum makes ovum, dad makes sperm. Neither are bodies and neither have souls. Both parents make millions of gametes and only a few (and sometimes none) become people.
At fertilisation things happen to allow the production of a new being. But the first cell is not a body, though it becomes a body. So the body is created at fertilisation or later by the parents. The soul is created by the parents also, but why should that be at fertilisation also?
A body does not exist in every sperm or ovum. Presumably neither does a soul. And even if parents make both, why does their creation need be contemporous?
Could not soul-gametes be certain DNA and the soul be created when certain soul RNA is encoded, and could that not be much later in the development of the zygote?
I am not arguing for creationism over traducianism, I am just saying that abortion may be somewhat related to when the soul comes into existence and both theories can have that at fertilisation and both theories can have that at another stage.
kyle on 05 Mar 2008 at 7:36 am #
CMP,
I am very distraught over your statement “Can a Christian support abortion? Yes, obviously.” Can a Christian support ethnic cleansing in Africa? Can a Christian support the KKK’s lynchings? Can a Christian support kiddie porn?
I realize the examples I am using are extreme — but so is the murder of innocent children. It simply cannot be both ways. Abortion is either the murder of a human being, or it is not. There is no middle ground here. I am too boneheaded to pick up on the significance of all this “soul” stuff, and I do not know why it matters. The child growing inside of the womb is either refuse or life. To me, the first line that must be drawn is whether or not a fetus is a human being. If a fetus is no different than a cardboard box which must be broken down and thrown away, then abortion certainly cannot be wrong. If you truly believe, however, that there is a human being who is being injected with saline and then sliced up into little pieces, surely you cannot support this and be called a Christian. IF abortion is the grisly taking of human life, then it is sin. Countenancing this sin, telling people you can support murder and yet be a Christian is unthinkable (at least to me).
If you believe abortion is wrong — and I am guessing that you do, then how do you justify saying one can be a Christian and support murder?
I have really enjoyed reading your blog. I particularly enjoy the manner in which you tackle so many tough issues with such respect and love. Freedom to explore issues with other Christians is a blessing. Disagreements are generally handled by you with perfect aplomb. But I am afraid the rubber stamp has extended too far on this issue. So here are my questions:
1. Is a one month old unborn child a human being. (I use this age because, in our experience with our three children, we were more than a month along before we realized my wife was pregnant. I think this is fairly common). Is it life, the taking of which would be considered killing?
If you answer no to number one, there is no need to proceed to number two. Clearly, abortion is not a problem if we are just removing an unwanted lump of connective tissue from a woman.
2. If it is killing, how can you support this and still be a Christian?
Thanks Michael. I understand from Dan’s entry regarding e-mails that many times you just get spread too thin to respond. I am sure the same thing holds true with active blogs. If you cannot respond, I truly understand and thank you for the hard work you do on this blog and for the challenging issues you discuss.
Kyle
Minnowspeaks on 05 Mar 2008 at 8:40 am #
Kyle–I don’t pretend to answer for CMP nor do I support abortion, however how one believes or acts with regard to abortion does not determine how they believe with regard to Christ. It effects how well they follow certain teachings. As Luke has tried to point out some other issues ie: our positions with regard to war, also illustrate how well we “witness” with our behavior what we confess with our mouths.
Truth Unites... and Divides on 05 Mar 2008 at 9:54 am #
Matthew 25:40 And the King will answer them, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.’
Let’s take that verse and see how it may have some applicability in the context of this blog post.
Can you imagine the woman (or man) who cries out “Lord, Lord . . .†and Jesus looks at her (or him) and says “You killed me.â€
The woman (or man) would look a bit befuddled and reply, “When, Lord? I am a Christian.â€
“When I was in the womb, you supported killing me, for whatever you did to the least of my brothers, that you did unto me.â€
———–
41 Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.’
Seth R. on 05 Mar 2008 at 10:20 am #
Alright Michael, why does having an as-yet incomplete “soul” make the fetus a “person?” For instance, what if you belief a chicken has a “soul” of sorts. Not a human soul of course, but some form of spiritual animation that informs the merely biological? Does that mean no more KFC? Or is merely having a soul not enough to make a person?
And secondly, why is granting a fetus the status of “person” the end of the discussion? It seems to me there are various degrees of “personhood.” What is allowed or prohibited seems to be a function of degrees to me rather than an absolute “this is human and this isn’t” kind of dichotomy.
Don’t get me wrong, I don’t support abortion generally (especially late-term abortion). But I oppose it for entirely different reasons than the “murder” argument. To call the termination of something that looks like a tadpole “murder” seems counterintuitive at best. Any attribution of “full person” status to such a creature seems utterly speculative, regardless of whether you are relying on biology or the Bible.
The arguments about “person” and “murder” seem more like artificial lawyer talk to me than gospel-truth.
JohnT3 on 05 Mar 2008 at 10:38 am #
After reading all the “Banter” shall we say I have a question. While it is a hypothetical situation it is a very possible hypothetical situation.
OK here you go:
A young chrsitian couple rush to the emergency room. They are 28 weeks along in a very difficult pregnancy. After the doctors examine Mom and the baby they come and sit the father down and tell him that this is an critical situation and as it now looks you have 2 choices:
1.) Save the baby
2.) Save your wife
So what is he to do? This is a decision that many christians have had to face.
So what does he do? And let me set a ground rule right now.
NO COPOUTS WILL BE ACCEPTED OR TOLERATED.
Jugulum on 05 Mar 2008 at 10:47 am #
Aaron,
I think the more timely, practical question is whether or not abortion becomes the only issue that is relevant from a voter standpoint. I know many Christians who flatly refuse to vote for politicians if they are pro-choice, no matter what. However, I think a little more thoughtful discretion is necessary when making that choice.
I agree that this is a rather timely question, and that it deserves more thought than some people give it.
Especially when considering the politician’s ability/willingness to actually affect the type of change that Christians are looking for.
Yes. Though I think I would put the “willingness” issue in another category–that goes to whether or not the politician is really pro-life or not. So, for the rest I’m assuming that the politician would genuinely act/make decisions/vote in a pro-life manner.
So, when you’re evaluating a pro-choice candidate, you should ask, “What kind of effect on abortion would they have?” Does the office have anything to do with affecting abortion policy? If it does, will the issue come up while they’re in office?
For the presidency, I would have an extremely difficult time ever voting for a pro-choice candidate. If I couldn’t vote for the other major candidate, I might vote for a more acceptable third-party. Why? Because the president appoints judges. That’s huge.
For a city council election, I could probably vote for a pro-choice candidate–the issue doesn’t matter so much at that level.
In between, it gets harder.
Jugulum on 05 Mar 2008 at 10:51 am #
Seth said,
And secondly, why is granting a fetus the status of “person†the end of the discussion? It seems to me there are various degrees of “personhood.†What is allowed or prohibited seems to be a function of degrees to me rather than an absolute “this is human and this isn’t†kind of dichotomy.
Looking back at the history of what has happened when cultures believed that some humans are less of a “person” than others, I’m surprised that anyone is willing to go that route.
Jeff Haynes on 05 Mar 2008 at 11:06 am #
Dan said,
“Not by YELLING at them, especially if they are well-educated. An MDiv will not be impressive to the doctor or lawyer, or in my case the ABD in Biblical Studies from an Ivy-League school.”
I would hope the Doctor or lawyer would respect the MDiv
because that signifies specialized training in the area of
theology. The Doctor or lawyer are skilled in medicine and
law but not theology. If they want to defend their position
for abortion, that is fine but don’t look down at the MDiv.
I’ve know some Doctors and lawyers who were smart
but not in theology.
Eric W on 05 Mar 2008 at 11:28 am #
After reading all the “Banter†shall we say I have a question. While it is a hypothetical situation it is a very possible hypothetical situation.
OK here you go:
A young Christian couple rush to the emergency room. They are 28 weeks along in a very difficult pregnancy. After the doctors examine Mom and the baby they come and sit the father down and tell him that this is an critical situation and as it now looks you have 2 choices:
1.) Save the baby
2.) Save your wife
So what is he to do? This is a decision that many Christians have had to face.
So what does he do? And let me set a ground rule right now.
NO COPOUTS WILL BE ACCEPTED OR TOLERATED.
Not necessarily an answer, but a comparison of two Biblical responses (i.e., responses by groups which derive their practices from the Bible and/or Biblically-based traditions):
IIRC, the Roman Catholic position is to do nothing - i.e., one cannot kill the baby in order to save the mother’s life, nor can one kill the mother in order to save the baby.
IIRC, the Jewish position is option 2., especially if she has other living children that need her care.
(Sorry for the copout!)
C Michael Patton on 05 Mar 2008 at 11:31 am #
Seth, it is hard for me to follow comparing a chicken with a person on any level. I don’t think that you could find theological support for a chicken being in the image of God. I don’t mean to sound sarcastic here, but that is the way I look at your analogy.
You said: “It seems to me there are various degrees of “personhood.”
I am willing to listen, but this statement in and of itself does not help. How are there different degrees of personhood? This seems like a vary dangerous statement to make. Please understand that I am not accusing you of this, but didn’t the Nazi’s make a simular argument. How would it be sustained and where does it end?
C Michael Patton on 05 Mar 2008 at 11:32 am #
Jug, you said what I said
Just noticed it.
dan on 05 Mar 2008 at 11:38 am #
” would hope the Doctor or lawyer would respect the MDiv
because that signifies specialized training in the area of
theology. The Doctor or lawyer are skilled in medicine and
law but not theology. If they want to defend their position
for abortion, that is fine but don’t look down at the MDiv.
I’ve know some Doctors and lawyers who were smart
but not in theology.” Fair enough.
But as a former MA and MDiv student, the vast majority of my classmates did not have the aptitude to make it into medical school or a decent law school. The rigors of a zondervan textbook doesn’t seem to compare with OChem. Their theological thinking was often nothing more than proof-texting, using Grudem or something. It was a shame they couldn’t read Tillich and digest him without saying that he didn’t believe in inerrancy and so his whole foundation was built on sand.
Perhaps the indictment is against evangelical seminaries, and to be quite honest, low-ranked mainline seminaries. They simply don’t have the rigor or the (general) intellectual caliber of schools like HDS, YDS, PTS–where many of my new classmates graduated from.
I have an MA and MDiv and I wouldn’t say that most of my classes prepared me to be a “master” or “doyen” of theology.
Jugulum on 05 Mar 2008 at 11:47 am #
CMP,
Right, but I tried wording it so as to avoid Godwin’s Law.
Thomas Twitchell on 05 Mar 2008 at 12:35 pm #
If you didn’t know the water was safe to drink would you still drink?
Sandra Day O’Conner thought it improper to impose her view of reality on the rest of society in her refusal to rule for life over against the unknown. Which simply meant that she was unwilling to do the job, for that cannot be avoided when interpreting the Constitution as it applies itself to the governance of the people. In other words she abrogated her responsibility as a Judge and violated her oath of office. Can we likewise claim ignorance as a shield against the charge of malfeasance when we make ourselves the judges of reality? Which is worse, to be ignorant and kill when you could have refrained, or to kill willfully? God simply says choose life.
To be in possession of stolen property is a crime whether you know it is stolen or not. The law holds you responsible to identify it for what it is.
Who knows when the soul is united to the body? Who knows if the water is safe to drink? And if there is no one who can say one or the other, drink to life or death if you will. But your decision will not cause the drink to be what it is.
The question then is much like it is when identifying a target when hunting. It is against the law to discharge a firearm without positive identification. Interesting that we treat laws concerning the outcome of uninformed decisions in respect to hunting, and possession, with such great regard, but not the issue of human life.
Do this and you will be charged with homicide: Run over an unidentified object in the road. If it happens to be an infant wrapped in a blanket, which your vehicle kills, you have committed homicide, however ignorantly unintentional. You may get off at the discretion and mercy of the court. But, the fact remains, the child that you could not identify is still dead.
Take a drink.
Jugulum on 05 Mar 2008 at 12:58 pm #
Thomas:
I like the way Greg Koukl makes a similar point.
Suppose your five-year-old child calls from another room, “Mommy, can I kill this?” What do you have to be really sure of before you can answer?
singer saved by grace on 05 Mar 2008 at 1:03 pm #
Michael, thanks so much for this post.
I’m very uncomfortable writing but this topic really interests me. So I’ll toss in a few of my thoughts? I don’t think I am saved because I believe the right things. I believe people are saved because God chose to save us. And it makes sense to me that God chooses some to become believers. We are marked for salvation, possibly saved before we come to know Christ. I still know very little about Christ but I believe I am His. If we are chosen and able we eventually learn about our Father, and we may learn to speak about our belief. Since God knows those who belong to him (those marked for life) even before the foundation of the world, my thinking is that God may choose those who were aborted. The chosen aborted live with him and the unchosen are forever apart from him in hell. If our eternal destiny is up to God, I’m not comfortable declaring to anyone that their aborted baby is in heaven or hell.
I am comfortable saying we should not rebel against God’s plan. But are all children planned by God? I wouldn’t abort for the same reasons that I wouldn’t commit suicide, or commit a murder . But as I write that I can think of instances where I might commit suicide (a spy with info that must remain secret), abort(tubal pregnancy) or kill someone (war). I wonder what our responsibility is for the life we create. Weren’t parents called upon to stone children who they could not keep in line? Could there be a merciful, responsible, Christian choice to abort or is it always better to give birth? I sense a great responsibility for my children. Isn’t it that responsibility that causes some to choose abortion? As we join God in his creative work what is our responsibility? Didn’t Hitler believe he was doing a good thing?
Jugulum on 05 Mar 2008 at 1:03 pm #
JohnT3,
That’s a hard question. I don’t know that it has a single right answer: It’s very close to the general ethical dilemma involved in triage. When you can only save one person, whom do you save?
But it differs from triage if you have to take a positive action to kill one of the two people in order to save the other. In that, it’s closer to siamese twins.
Dave Z on 05 Mar 2008 at 1:24 pm #
I’ve often wondered about the history of abortion. Seems like it’s something the ancients could have figured out, so I’d expect to find some specific reference in Scripture, but I’m not aware of any.
******************
Update to my own post (even before I post it)
******************
Here’s a link to an interesting article that addresses some things I’ve been curious about, including ancient references.
http://www.lcms.org/graphics/assets/media/WRHC/187_A Historical Summary of Abortion.PDF
Might have to copy and paste that.
Here’s a link:
http://www.wordwiz72.com/chscript.html
to another essay that specifically addresses the apparent lack of Biblical mention. This guy says a passage in Numbers specifically allows, and in fact prescribes, abortion in the case of adultery. I question the accuracy of his interpretation, and I’m curious to hear what others think. I did find other support for that interpretation. It seems like a somewhat challenging passage to me. Anyway, this essay led me to the link posted above.
Dave
kyle on 05 Mar 2008 at 1:24 pm #
John T3,
I am not certain I fully understand how your question relates to the issue. In your fact scenario, someone is going to die. As a result of saving one person, another person loses his or her life. Abortion, at least as I assumed it was posed in CMP’s post, was about the choice to affirmatively end the existence of a fetus — not permit one to die because you needed to save the mother (or vice-versa). Even your post says “save the baby, save your wife.” Accept my apologies for the artificial lawyer talk copout!
Seth R,
Your chicken argument looks a little more like artificial lawyer talk than my artificial lawyer talk (I presume you knew I was a lawyer prior to making the comment — or perhaps my posts are that transparent — or perhaps both).
Jeff Haynes and Dan,
I am a lawyer, and I have the utmost respect for a degree in MDiv and ABD in Biblical studies. Dan Wallace’s intelligence boggles my mind. And the fact that he corresponded often with my all-time hero, Bruce M. Metzger, creates a jealousy in me I cannot explain. All of you people in this blog are way beyond me in matters of theology — that’s why I have to reduce things down to matters a layperson simpleton artificial arguer can understand. I literally have done everything in my power to insure that my children are missionaries and preachers — and in NO CIRCUMSTANCES a lawyer. And that is the gospel truth. In fact, once my children are finally out of school, my plans are to return and try my hardest to do what the two of you have already accomplished. My prior posts should be ample evidence that any rube with a college degree can pass law school.
Minnowspeaks,
Thanks for the post. In all honesty, I still do not understand the subtle distinction you and CMP make. I am sure I am the lost sheep on this and this is precisely why I posed the questions I did to CMP. Your post speaks to abortion and says “how one believes or acts with regard to abortion does not determine how they believe with regard to Christ.” Why can the same not be said of lynchings. In the old south, many families would attend a lynching and then be at worship service the following Sunday. Remember, I am beginning with the assumption that a fetus is a “full person.” If you begin with that premise, how can you say it is ok to support abortion as a Christian? I honestly ask this question with all seriousness. Thanks.
In all fairness, not only am I a father of three, but I am a youth minister and very much involved with our childrens’ work as well. I will admit that my worldview is heavily, heavily, heavily weighted against abortion. Consequently, my reading of the scriptures may be somewhat skewed. I am sure no one got that in my posts. Anyway, thanks to all of you for your posts.
Kyle
Truth Unites... and Divides on 05 Mar 2008 at 1:30 pm #
Dan boasts: “But as a former MA and MDiv student, the vast majority of my classmates did not have the aptitude to make it into medical school or a decent law school. The rigors of a zondervan textbook doesn’t seem to compare with OChem. Their theological thinking was often nothing more than proof-texting, using Grudem or something. It was a shame they couldn’t read Tillich and digest him without saying that he didn’t believe in inerrancy and so his whole foundation was built on sand.
Perhaps the indictment is against evangelical seminaries, and to be quite honest, low-ranked mainline seminaries. They simply don’t have the rigor or the (general) intellectual caliber of schools like HDS, YDS, PTS–where many of my new classmates graduated from.”
Dan, much thanks for the good laugh. I always get a kick when a mainliner confirms the image of a liberal Pharisee with his prideful arrogance and condescension.
Please do continue.
Jugulum on 05 Mar 2008 at 1:43 pm #
Dan said:
It was a shame they couldn’t read Tillich and digest him without saying that he didn’t believe in inerrancy and so his whole foundation was built on sand.
I hope you meant to say, “It’s a shame they couldn’t read and digest him and say more than that his foundation was built on sand.”
Perhaps the indictment is against evangelical seminaries, and to be quite honest, low-ranked mainline seminaries.
Why broadbrush evangelical seminaries in general? Is that more than bigotry on your part? (Seriously, I’m asking. Do you have a particular reason for it?)
On this subject, I’m reminded of Mark D. Roberts’ appearance on Converse with Scholars. IIRC, he discusses his experience getting his BA, MA, and PhD at Harvard. He observed that, generally speaking, it was its own little world–people were simply unaware of the argumentation of theologically conservative scholarship. In a nutshell, the liberals weren’t reading the conservatives.
This is just to say: There are plenty of people on both sides who deserve criticism for shoddy approaches. And broadbrushing either side is hardly a mark of the intellectual maturity that seems to be part of your self-image.
Marvin the Martian on 05 Mar 2008 at 1:44 pm #
I always get a kick when a mainliner confirms the image of a liberal Pharisee
TU&D,
Dan actually says this about himself in another thread:
“I went to an evangelical seminary, only now do I go to an Ivy University. I’m actually extremely conservative. I still call myself a fundamentalist (progressive).”
You need to get your facts straight.
Truth Unites... and Divides on 05 Mar 2008 at 1:51 pm #
Dan (via Marvin): “I’m actually extremely conservative.”
Dan: “I’m a Christian and I support abortion.”
Sorry Dan. An extremely conservative Christian does not support abortion.
Truth Unites... and Divides on 05 Mar 2008 at 2:06 pm #
Seth R.: “And secondly, why is granting a fetus the status of “person†the end of the discussion? It seems to me there are various degrees of “personhood.†What is allowed or prohibited seems to be a function of degrees to me rather than an absolute “this is human and this isn’t†kind of dichotomy.
The arguments about “person†and “murder†seem more like artificial lawyer talk to me than gospel-truth.”
Seth R., at what point was the personhood of Jesus present?
JFrances on 05 Mar 2008 at 2:45 pm #
Friendly neighborhood Catholic weighing in here. . .
In response to the extreme scenario posed by JohnT3, whereby a decision to save either the life of an unborn baby or a mother is being considered, Eric W (comment #33) offered:
“IIRC, the Roman Catholic position is to do nothing - i.e., one cannot kill the baby in order to save the mother’s life, nor can one kill the mother in order to save the baby.”
As a Catholic, informed of the Church’s teachings, I would like to point out that this assessment is inaccurate. The Catholic Church does not teach a position of “do nothing.” “Do[ing] nothing,” in fact, would in most cases (if not all) be considered immoral given such a scenario. The Church’s teachings are based primarily on a theological understanding of the sanctity of life. The life of the mother and the life of the unborn baby are BOTH sacred.
The “Roman Catholic position,” is directed by certain principles which are always respectful of the lives of both patients.
The U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops offers these directives, especially in the case of ectopic pregnancies:
· In the case of extrauterine pregnancy, no intervention is morally licit which constitutes a direct abortion.[2]
· Operations, treatments and medications that have as their direct purpose the cure of a proportionately serious pathological condition of a pregnant woman are permitted when they cannot be safely postponed until the unborn child is viable, even if they will result in the death of the unborn child.[3]
Translation: Hard decisions must sometimes be made. To “do nothing” is neither respectful of the life of the mother nor the life of the unborn baby.
A really great treatment of this very topic, as it applies to Catholic moral teaching, can be found here:
http://www.cuf.org/faithfacts/details_view.asp?ffID=57
JoanieD on 05 Mar 2008 at 2:56 pm #
Dave Z in #42, thanks for the link to http://www.lcms.org/graphics/assets/media/WRHC/187_A%20Historical%20Summary%20of%20Abortion.PDF
The paper was very interesting to read.
A few things that struck me most was:
“One particular concern is the number of illegal or criminal abortions that are being performed under our present laws. It is believed that between 10 and 20 criminal abortions are
performed every 15 minutes in the United States. Estimates of 2,500 per day are not unusual, and it may be that the actual number is a great deal larger.”
“In addition to the fact that some women cannot receive an abortion under the very liberal laws, there are those who do not want to publicize their pregnancy and who do not wish to
comply with the regulations. These women seek an illegal abortion. Some of these no doubt could receive a legal abortion, but others cannot meet the requirements of the statute.”
“In the Soviet Union in 1968 nearly three out of four pregnancies were terminated by an abortion. It was found that the abortion rate was three times greater for working women than for housewives. In another study 16% of the Soviet women studied had more than one abortion a year, and in a study of 1,350 women in Leningrad who had had a legal abortion, 70% had had two or more abortions and 12% had had six or more abortions. It was found that 18½% of all admissions of women in Soviet hospitals were for the purpose of abortions.”
What this says to me is:
1. Women who have sex should be quite certain that if a pregnancy results, they are ready, willing and happy to give birth to those children.
2. Women need good BIRTH CONTROL methods.
3. Making abortions illegal will NOT STOP abortions.
How could the reduction of abortions come about? A woman needs to be taught right from early childhood that she is VALUABLE and that her body is precious and should not be used by herself or anyone else in a way that demeans her, disrepects her, harms her health, etc. As she learns to think of herself that way, she will learn to make good choices regarding reproduction. (i.e….she will realize that it is not telling the guy you really love him if you don’t use birth control! And hopefully, she will not be having sex with ANYONE who is not also in a position to help raise a possible child.)
What this whole discussion has also shown me is that though we obviously agree to discuss religion here, the tone of many of the comments here seem to indicate that politics can bring out the hurtful ways of behaving towards one another. I can understand how some say to avoid discussion of religion and politics. (But gee, those are some of the interesting things in life!)
Joanie D.
Eric W on 05 Mar 2008 at 3:28 pm #
JFrances:
My “do nothing” description of the Roman Catholic teaching was obviously a poor way to express it. Maybe I should have worded it differently. Thanks for your comments and the links.
I noted that my Didache post/quote was removed (too much Greek?). Anyway, it was to point out that Didache 2:2 says: “Thou shalt not murder a child by abortion, nor commit infanticide.” I.e., the early church’s stance on abortion was to prohibit it.
Truth Unites... and Divides on 05 Mar 2008 at 3:55 pm #
“Women need good BIRTH CONTROL methods.”
Joanie D. meet JFrances.
“Making abortions illegal will NOT STOP abortions.”
I have not seen anyone make this claim.
Look at it the other way. Making abortions illegal will save more lives.
“As she learns to think of herself that way, she will learn to make good choices regarding reproduction. (i.e….she will realize that it is not telling the guy you really love him if you don’t use birth control! And hopefully, she will not be having sex with ANYONE who is not also in a position to help raise a possible child.)”
How about just following God’s teaching in His Word that faithful sexual behavior only happens within a one-man-and-one-woman marriage?
JohnT3 on 05 Mar 2008 at 3:59 pm #
While a couple of brave souls had the courage to answer the question, and will get 2 points for the effort.
But as I stated no copouts allowed so no more points
It is easy to take a stance that abortion is wrong ot that your are in favor of a women’s right to her decision.
This is a real life situation that christians have faced.
Let me pose another question that maybe easier
Why is abortion wrong?
Back up your answer with scripture.
Creeds or Statements of Policy from Leadership are not allowed. And as before No Copouts allowed either.
Hey CMP care to help us with either question?
Jugulum on 05 Mar 2008 at 4:12 pm #
“Back up your answer with scripture.”
2 Hezekiah 4:2. It’s right there, plain as day!
links for 2008-03-06 « Commonplace Book on 05 Mar 2008 at 7:27 pm #
[...] Reclaiming the Mind Ministries » Can Christians Support Abortion? A Theology of Abortion (tags: abortion christian theology) [...]
Seth R. on 05 Mar 2008 at 8:35 pm #
TUAD,
Interesting you should ask. We Mormons take a variety of views - though most are morally opposed to abortion. Some believe the whole package is complete at conception (an increasingly marginalized viewpoint). But 3 Nephi 1:13 (Book of Mormon) raises some interesting questions as to at what point Christ’s soul was actually attached to his body in Mary’s womb.
The predominant view I personally take away from statements of modern LDS leadership is that abortion is objectionable more from a personal responsibility standpoint, and for the lack of respect for the sacred procreative process that it represents than because it’s murder per se. Earlier LDS authorities sometimes held it to be murder, but you don’t hear much of that anymore.
In case anyone was curious, the official LDS position carves out exceptions in its prohibition on abortion for rape, incest, danger to life or health of mother, and a fetus unable to survive beyond birth. Even those aren’t automatic though.
Not to make this a discussion of Mormonism or anything, but you did ask.
JFrances on 05 Mar 2008 at 10:44 pm #
Oh, goodness, this is bound to break some commenting rules on length (forgive or edit as needed!). . .
“Joanie D. meet JFrances.”
Oddly enough, I agree with Joanie D (with qualifications, of course). The link between contraception and abortion simply can not be ignored. In every thorough assessment of the evil of abortion, the topic of birth control emerges. If abortion isn’t the answer. . .better birth control always seems more palatable.
I don’t mean to derail this topic on abortion, but just as Joanie D suggests, it is hard to talk about abortion without recognizing its link to contraception. If we want less abortions, one obvious direction—without interfering with our appetite for sex—is less pregnancy. That’s obvious.
Q: Why do we have abortion? A: So that we can have sex and avoid unwanted human beings. Q: Why do we have contraception? A: So that we can have sex and avoid unwanted human beings.
Now, of course, I’m not so glib as to suggest there aren’t other mitigating factors for both abortion and contraceptives, but the common root purpose remains the same.
Regarding “good BIRTH CONTROL methods†and our need for them. . .Enter natural family planning (NFP). While we (as a culture) are fervently trying and testing the various forms of contraceptives so that we (as a culture) can continue to have sex and avoid unwanted human beings, we generally overlook fertility awareness as a viable alternative. Why? The answers vary. Some say the end (regulation of birth) is the same, so the means don’t matter. Others say it is simply too hard or too sacrificial. Still others challenge the efficacy of NFP.
Yes, the end is the same, but I could just as easily get into my size 2 jeans by puking in a toilet every time I eat than if I chose to exercise and exercise self-control. Christianity is hard. Following Jesus means sacrifice. GK Chesterton said about Christianity, “The Christian ideal has not been tried and found wanting; it has been found difficult and left untried.” Insert following God’s design for sex within marriage, per the historical teaching of the Christian faith, as a “Christian ideal†and I think that just about sums up why people REALLY use contraceptives.
Boiling it down, however, even if “good BIRTH CONTROL methods†can be qualified as the percentage rate of unexpected pregnancies, NFP (or fertility awareness) would still get a good snubbing from the average pew sitter (Protestants and Catholics alike). Fertility awareness consistently comes in extraordinarily effective among methods of birth regulation (see http://healthcenter.ucdavis.edu/topics/contraception/efficacy.html), but it is still a hard sell—even for the most pro-life Christian.
The lack of interest in NFP among Christians is particularly interesting as, according to the most up to date research, the only methods of birth control which equal or surpass fertility awareness’s efficacy in perfect-use failure rates is hormonal contraception (the pill, the patch, implants, and IUDs). Yet, all of these have abortifacient mechanisms which, no doubt, lend help to the better efficacy rate.
To be honest, I don’t know what you mean by “good BIRTH CONTROL methodsâ€â€”I could be way off. But on the chance that you were lobbying for better hormonal contraceptives, it must be considered that a demand for better efficacy would most surely also entail better abortifacient mechanisms? And, thus, in our effort to reduce abortions through better birth control we would end up simply promoting earlier abortions.
And, again, we must consider theologically if a 5 day old unborn human being is somehow less human, less sacred, less made in the image and likeness of God than a 5 month old unborn human being.
Truth Unites... and Divides on 06 Mar 2008 at 1:51 pm #
John T3 asks: “Why is abortion wrong? Back up your answer with scripture.”
Here’s apologist and professor Doug Groothuis answer (which I fully affirm):
“The biblical argument against abortion is direct and powerful:
1. The fetus is a person made in God’s image (Gen. 1:27; Psalm 139:13-16).
2. Murder is unjustly killing a person and is sinful (Exodus 20:13).
3. Abortion is (all things being equal) the unjust killing of a person. Exception: when life of
the mother is directly endangered.
4. Therefore: (a) abortion is morally wrong and sinful before God.
5. Therefore: (b) abortion should be illegal and stigmatized socially (Romans 13:1-7).”
From: http://theconstructivecurmudgeon.blogspot.com/2008/03/recoving-from-fetus-fatigue.html
KWK on 09 Mar 2008 at 5:11 pm #
TU&D:
You ask us to consider Psalm 139:13-16. OK, here goes:
13 For you created my inmost being;
you knit me together in my mother’s womb.
14 I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made;
your works are wonderful,
I know that full well.
15 My frame was not hidden from you
when I was made in the secret place.
When I was woven together in the depths of the earth,
16 your eyes saw my unformed body.
All the days ordained for me
were written in your book
before one of them came to be.
While I see that humans are “fearfully and wonderfully made”, I see no specific condemnation of abortion here. Yes, God’s works are “wonderful”, but does that mean humans never have the right–or even the duty!–to alter the “wonderful” states of affairs that arise naturally (I’m thinking of, say, pain in childbirth here)?
Furthermore, I am extremely uncomfortable taking such a passage as clearly espousing any particular course of action when it also teaches that a fetus is “woven together in the depths of the earth”. Of course this particular statement is not meant to be taken literally. But then that opens up a whole can of worms with respect to the rest of the passage as well: Is it normative? Or simply descriptive? Or was the writer inspired to record thoughts and feelings that were not themselves inspired (and therefore not authoritative in the same sense)? This last point, in particular, is how I tend to view the imprecatory Psalms, as well as passages such as Daniel 4. I would have trouble if Scripture were truly intending to teach that “the spirit of the holy gods” (plural!) was in Daniel, rather than simply intending to record Nebuchadnezzar’s correspondence.
So if you are hoping to defend your position from Scripture, try again.
On a related issue, if the immorality of abortion is only discoverable by special revelation, then how can we hold our nonChristian society to *our* norms? We don’t outlaw everything that is contrary to God’s Law. And even societies that were (ostensibly) theocracies, like ancient Israel, made allowances for deviations from God’s Laws. I’m thinking specifically of Jesus’s defense of the legality (as opposed to the morality) of divorce.
I would venture that Jesus was, in today’s parlance, “personally opposed” to divorce, but at the same time it appears he did not want society to “force His morality” on others. Of course some morality is always “forced” on any society by its members, but specifically in the case of societies that have not agreed to live under God’s law, this enforced morality is almost entirely confined to areas which are amenable to analysis by reason and general revelation. So if we can argue against abortion only by recourse to the Bible, how *can* we argue against it with those who don’t accept the authority of Scripture?
I realize this is not quite the same question that was initially asked, but this seems to me a much more salient point.
Truth Unites... and Divides on 10 Mar 2008 at 12:35 am #
Of course some morality is always “forced†on any society by its members, but specifically in the case of societies that have not agreed to live under God’s law, this enforced morality is almost entirely confined to areas which are amenable to analysis by reason and general revelation. So if we can argue against abortion only by recourse to the Bible, how *can* we argue against it with those who don’t accept the authority of Scripture?
I take it that you are not familiar with “natural law”, something that well-informed Catholics are very knowledgeable about.
Please read this article:
Abortion: Correct Application of Natural Law Theory
http://www.lifeissues.net/writers/irv/irv_08natlaw.html
Pax.
JeannieM on 13 Mar 2008 at 5:10 am #
As a Christian who had an abortion before becoming a Christian, maybe I can share a little perspective on this issue from another view. I had an abortion when I was 15 years old. I will leave out all the horrific details, but if I were in an assembly, I wouldn’t leave out not even one. Abortion is horrible. It rips out the heart of a woman and shreds it into a million pieces, her soul is bruised and battered. Many women don’t sufffer until years after, but I did right away. I suffered from depression for 12 years and right before commiting suicide, God delivered me. I was married and had 3 children at the time. They could not dull the pain. I had had 3 miscarriages (I never suffered depression because of them). I suffered because I had killed an innocent life, a beautiful little life that I should have accepted as a blessing. I have been forgiven. I love the Lord and He loves me, but I live with that choice even after 25 years and 6 beautiful children. Abortion is a sin. It kills and it destroys. If anyone chooses to take on the responsibilty to support abortion, they should be ready to help broken women mend their shattered lives, but I believe that only Jesus Christ has the power to do that.
Truth Unites... and Divides on 13 Mar 2008 at 11:14 am #
JeannieM,
Thanks for sharing such a powerful story. May the Lord use your story to minister to others.
Peace in Christ alone,
Truth Unites… and Divides
Juno, abortion, pro-life/pro-choice « my contemplations on 28 Mar 2008 at 5:02 am #
[...] not for the faint of heart)? On Parchment and Pen a while ago. Micheal Paton wrote this post on a theological understanding of abortion, also saying that we cannot defend abortion theologically in any [...]