William P. Young’s book, The Shack
I’m busy these days trying to crank out more than a thousand words a day on a church history text contracted by Zondervan, and I don’t have a lot of spare time. I leave it to my readers as to whether or not I should expend the money and time to buy and read The Shack. The book is getting incredible BUZZ and the vast vast majority of reviews on Amazon are 5 star. Here is what Eugene Peterson says:
When the imagination of a writer and the passion of a theologian cross-fertilize the result is a novel on the order of The Shack. This book has the potential to do for our generation what John Bunyan’s Pilgrim’s Progress did for his. It’s that good!
I learned about the book from my friend Greg Albrecht (editor of Plain Truth Magazine); his review is equally glowing:
You will be captivated by the creativity and imagination of The Shack, and before you know it, you’ll be experiencing God as never before. William Young’s insights are not just captivating, they are biblically faithful and true. Don’t miss this transforming story of grace.
But there is also Michael Burton’s review, one of the two 1-star reviews on Amazon: He says the book is for you if, and only if . . . .
You want to recreate God in your own image;
You find Isaiah’s portrayal of a holy God seated upon His throne to be a disturbing image;
You would prefer to metaphorically cast God the Father as a loving and large black woman named “Papa,” Jesus as a laid back and friendly Middle Eastern man, and the Holy Spirit as a calm and cool Asian woman;
You want a God so small that you and she/he/she can just hang out together as best buddies;
You regard the Bible as an extremely biased, narrow-minded, and insufficient revelation of God in leather binding with “guilt edges” (page 65);
You therefore believe that God talks to people today, and that whatever she or he says to people trumps biblical truth (page 66);
You believe that God is never to be feared (page 90). . . .
Who is this guy, William P. Young? Here is his own self-effacing bio:
The Shack was a story written for my six children, with no thought or intention to publish. It is as much a surprise to me as to anyone else that I am now an ‘author’. Overall, I am a very simple guy; I have one wife, six kids, two daughter-in-laws and two grandkids on the way. I work as a general manager, janitor and inside sales guy for a friend who owns a small manufacturers rep company in Milwaukie, Oregon, and I live in a small rented house in Gresham, Oregon, that Kim has made into a marvelous home. My time is spent loving the people that are a part of my life. I am not connected, or a part, or a member of, or involved inside any sort of organization or movement anywhere. The truth is that I doubt anyone would want me. From my perspective that is a very positive thing … for both of us. I have lots of incredible friends, and now you are one of those.
My questions to you all are: Have you heard about the book? If so, what’s the BUZZ you’re getting? Have you read it? Should I expend my time and money on it?
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Josh M on 08 Feb 2008 at 6:29 pm #
The only time I’ve heard of it prior to now was when Tim Challies reviewed it a few weeks ago. He gave a less than glowing review and listed a handful of concerns he had about the contents of the book; those regarding distortions of the Trinity seemed the most alarming to me, I think. Overall, it sounded interesting enough that I might be tempted to read it for the purpose of talking to others about its contents (if I find that people around me are reading it), but otherwise, my to-read stack is large enough as it is.
iMonk on 09 Feb 2008 at 8:25 pm #
I read and reviewed it at InternetMonk.com. Highly creative, very stimulating, some theological errors and not the best writing ever. But it is a real discussion starter and I have given it to my family. My wife and son both loved it.
Eric W on 09 Feb 2008 at 8:35 pm #
A hint: God (i.e., God the Father) is the Oracle.
I thought the segment where the main character was to act as judge was quite compelling and thought-provoking.
Worth a purchase? I’d say borrow it from a friend and read it that way, or skim-read it at Barnes & Noble, and then decide.
Eugene Peterson has got to be kidding re: what he says about the book, though. It’s fun and interesting, but certainly not destined to be a “classic” nor worthy of that name, IMO.
john umland on 09 Feb 2008 at 8:50 pm #
I would agree with iMonk. It’s an enjoyable and short read, short enough to read in a few hours so the tedious parts of the book, wherein the problem of evil is resolved ;-), don’t last that long. It was stimulating and a great presentation of God’s grace. I have a short book report at my blog,
http://umbl0g.blogspot.com
God is good
jpu
Mike Jones on 10 Feb 2008 at 10:46 am #
http://www.challies.com/archives/book-reviews/the-shack-by-william-p-young.php
Eric W on 10 Feb 2008 at 2:39 pm #
Get an earful and/or eyeful (if you prefer the video stream) of the author here (3 parts):
Interview with William P. Young
JoanieD on 11 Feb 2008 at 8:01 am #
To iMonk…where on your blog can I find your review? Thanks.
Joanie D.
JoanieD on 11 Feb 2008 at 8:41 pm #
I was reading some of the reviews at Amazon and I have to say, they made me curious enough that I will likely read this book. It may be the kind of book that could help my husband if he would only read it. Some of the things reviewers said was:
“I must say this book wrecked my mind and heart but healed it too. It is an intense and fantastic read.”
“This is probably the most profound and best book I have ever read in my entire life. It has brought me totally back to God.”
“I have lived with Viet Nam inside me for over 35 years until recently. These are only some of the crosses I bear. This book has brought me full circle. It has helped me to restore my faith.”
“This is the best fiction book I have read in years and maybe ever. It has changed and greatly improved my God view. It has motivated me to live in a more selfless way.”
OK, some say the “theology” is not correct. Well, I think if a book can do the above things for people, let’s let them start from there. I know, I know, I am a liberal, a non-Calvinist, and all that other stuff. But if this book can help people believe that God loves them and wants to have a relationship with them, that can’t be bad. Sure, that is just the first step and then they will realize that they need to spend lots of time in prayer and study and that they will stumble lots of time as they try to live a selfless life. But at least they will have acknowledged their need for God. Isn’t that what we want, what God wants?
Joanie D.
JoanieD on 11 Feb 2008 at 9:03 pm #
http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/recommendation-and-review-the-shack-by-william-p-young
There, I finally found The Internet Monk’s review of the book. I am glad to see that he was moved by it and that he has purchased copies for other people. Thanks, Michael Spencer, for your perspective on this book.
Oh, I see you can read the entire first chapter here:
http://www.theshackbook.com/read.html
Joanie D.
Eric W on 11 Feb 2008 at 9:36 pm #
The “free” first chapter is not the best chapter in the book, IMO.
Theological problems and “Aunt Jemima” aside, I think it does some pretty interesting things with the questions/problems of evil and forgiveness. I can understand how it might greatly impact and even bring healing/closure to some people.
Is it sufficiently problematic that people might, through it, give their hearts and minds and devotion to a fictionalization of what one hopes God is like instead of to the true God? Are people in danger of inadvertently superimposing the concepts of the God of The Shack on the Scriptures when they read them?
Having seen people get carried away with Rick Joyner’s The Final Quest, a book whose theological and Scriptural problems exceed those that might be found in The Shack, I know there is a danger in well-crafted spiritual fiction (or in the case of The Final Quest, poorly-crafted spiritual fiction - which the author claims is not fiction at all, but his own higher-revelation-than-Scripture visions).
JoanieD on 11 Feb 2008 at 11:37 pm #
http://www.shermanlive.com/2007/12/04/the-shack-williampyoung-interview/
There are three video interviews there with the author, William P Young. They are done while the two of them are eating in a cafe, so there is noise and eating and whatnot. They are kind of long, maybe 20 minutes for the first two and 10 for the third one. I enjoyed them. I believe this man is “for real” and that he knows the presence and joy of God. And I haven’t even read the book yet! OK, enough of me posting about this. This will be the last until I have read the book…I think.
Joanie D.
WatchersWife on 13 Feb 2008 at 1:32 am #
So many people really love this book. It is a wonder to me how a book about
the Hindu god/goddess trinity can be sold and marketed as “Christian.” This is a
a very sad sign of the times!
larry moe curly on 13 Feb 2008 at 7:57 am #
So, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit = Brahma, Vishnu, and Shiva?
JoanieD on 13 Feb 2008 at 8:25 am #
http://www.shermanlive.com/2007/12/04/the-shack-williampyoung-interview/
Like I said in my other posts above, I haven’t read the book yet, but Amazon shipped it to me yesterday so it won’t be long now. But, listening to the author on the interviews above, I don’t get the feeling at all that he is promoting an Eastern religion. He seems firmly within the Jesus camp. But I can’t speak for the man.
Joanie D.
The Shack | Byrnesys Blabberings on 22 Feb 2008 at 10:43 am #
[...] may have been concepts which were hard to swallow for many Christians.The Parchment and Pen blog have given a feeling of the reactions from both sides with some more interesting comments in the comments section itself.There are also a plethora of [...]
Stew Carson on 28 Feb 2008 at 2:29 pm #
Terrific book- as good as Eugene Peterson describes.
Leslie on 29 Feb 2008 at 8:08 pm #
I totally agree with Michael Burton’s review. Unfortunately, this book has
permeated my church, and several people have been rather strong in their
defense of it; even though I have shown them, by quoting portions of
the book, that the author’s representation of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are
not even close to the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit of the Bible. And therein lies the rub.
I contacted the author via email with my concerns, and although he did
reply, he did not address any of the contradictions that I brought up.
The book has a strong new-age, sci-fi flavor. I would not recommend it to
anyone.
MarkF on 08 Mar 2008 at 8:18 pm #
This is very simple. Some doctrinal issues can be different amongst believers such as one of my best friends is OSAS and I believe in free will. This is okay because we believe in and have given our lives to the same God. However “The Shack” does not point to Jesus Christ of the Bible. The book claims that all on earth are forgiven and all will be saved, even those of false religions, atheists etc. This is not exceptable! This book is not from God but from Satan. Wake up people!
My wife and I are going through the book again and writing a descriptive report on it’s harassy so that others can be alerted to it’s lies. We have pages of notes already and we’ve barely made it to page 50. The hate and deception of William Young is overwhelming.
Longing for a Holiday on 10 Mar 2008 at 8:01 pm #
I wrote an Amazon review under Rick Kalal. I gave the book 1 star mostly because folks are undiscerning enough as it is and most won’t see the problems. There is no way you can 100% reconcile this book to the Bible. On the other hand, most of us have come through lots of bad, even heretical teaching unscathed.
Max on 14 Mar 2008 at 1:17 am #
I have a friend who is beginning to read this and she told me God shows up as a black woman named Papa, a guy named Jesus, and the Holy Spirit is an Asian woman.
RED FLAG!
A Christian ought to try and portray the Truth in an accurate way, not use confusing and even blasphemous images to distort the proper view of God. Such literary license is not enlightening, but is from the evil one because it paints a false image of God.
The one and only glorious Image of the Father is Jesus Christ. To physically portray Christ alongside another human called the Father is error. Nobody can see God, but it’s the Only Begotten alone Who reveals Him and manifests Him.
My Christian friends who are seeking discernment, cast this book aside. Or, if you have the wisdom, use this as an opportunity to discuss the Truth about the Trinity, that Jesus Christ is the one and only Image of the Father, therefore any other images are impossible, including black women named Papa.
Just as you do not have two bodies through which you express yourself, the Father does not have two Images of Himself among us, but only One: Jesus Christ.
Jesus said, “If you have seen Me you have seen the Father.”
Having a proper view of the Triune God is not a trivial thing. No matter how praiseworthy some aspects within this book may be, they cannot justify the major theological errors or the attitude that orthodox Truth doesn’t matter so much.
cynthia perez on 14 Mar 2008 at 8:07 pm #
What bothers me by some comments is the negativity.
While reading this book, I have had an encounter with Father, that was nothing short of divine and it went on throughout the whole book , and even days following the read. The book ministered Love like I have never seen Love before, by a Father who really cares for His children. So much so, that every aspect of our life is in His hands.
Although the book may not be for everyone, it sure has a wonderful value to so many of us. One that changes who we are forever!!
I so loved it, and will be eternally grateful for William Paul Young and all those connected with putting this treasure together. It is by far, the best book I have “ever” read.
Joy on 14 Mar 2008 at 11:13 pm #
This is a dangerous book,so many parts are filled with love and God’s restorastion for someone who has gone through such horrific things in their lives,but this is just a guys view of a God ,not the Holy Bible’s view.This is the type of book that throws the baby out with the bath water.I would not recommend this book,if you do read it,make sure you know the true word of God not just a point of view from this author.This is the work of the enemy of our souls.
Joy on 14 Mar 2008 at 11:18 pm #
This is a dangerous book,so many parts are supposedly filled with love and God’s restoration for someone who has gone through such horrific things in their lives,but this is just a guys view of a God ,not the Holy Bible’s view.This is the type of book that throws the baby out with the bath water.I would not recommend this book,if you do read it,make sure you know the true word of God not just a point of view from this author.This is the work of the enemy of our souls.He mask as a angel of light.
pl hendricks on 25 Mar 2008 at 11:45 am #
This book is certainly not for the religious and/or judgmental. So many “Christians” are blindly trapped in narrow-minded legalism to the point of having no idea what “freedom” is.
When my best friend recommended this book and described it, I was totally turned off and considered it “New Age”. I was not even interested in reading it at all, yet did so simply because she bought a copy for me. Do not go by what others say about this book: Just Read IT!!!!
I was raised in a wonderful “Christian” home yet had no idea what a relationship with God really was. I feared Him–and I do not mean that in a good way.
This book helps us understand how “real” each part of the Trinity is. It’s absolutely wonderful.
However, if you happen to be an arrogant-your-way-is-the-only-way-to-heaven “Christian”, then be prepared to hate this book and keep right on living in suffocating bondage.
-been there, done that
MarkF on 25 Mar 2008 at 5:58 pm #
Wow PL Hendricks I’m so pleased that you think every Christian who disapproves of the book is an “arrogant-your-way-is-the-only-way-to-heaven” and “are blindly trapped in narrow-minded legalism to the point of having no idea what “freedom†is”. What would we do without you to point us to the truth?
Could it possibly be that you are the one that’s wrong? There are millions of us out here that believe God’s plan for mankind is clearly written in His Word and when a book comes along that contradicts the Bible we cast it aside.
Did it take “The Shack” to show you God’s love? Could you not find it in scripture anywhere (see the crucifixion scene in each Gospel) or were you looking for a book that gets rid of all rules so you can freely live the lifestyle you want?
I highly suggest you read the Holy Bible for yourself. God does not change. His Word is true and eternal. Don’t trust William Young and his lies.
Hebrews 4:12-13 For the word of God is living and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart. Nothing in all creation is hidden from God’s sight. Everything is uncovered and laid bare before the eyes of him to whom we must give account.
pl hendricks on 25 Mar 2008 at 8:20 pm #
…and that, my dear Mark F, clearly proves my point…
~bless you
Max on 25 Mar 2008 at 9:29 pm #
There are different mindsets and different artforms appeal to different minds… however, nothing compares to the Orthodox Truth which was handed to the Church from the beginning.
When you discover the Beauty of that Truth and see these lower forms of “christianity,” it can produce a negative reaction so to speak… sort of like looking at a masterpiece of Monet or Da Vinci in person and then seeing someone try to reinterpret it with finger paint. Sure there might be a resemblance to the original and it might appear “hip, modern, and trendy” or perhaps just “cute” but really the new interpretation is truly pathetic when compared side-by-side with the originals and the masters. There’s no comparison really…
Yeah, there’s no need to get hurtful over it all, but there should be a determination to seek to remain with the highest forms that were handed down by the Fathers, the Apostles, and Christ Himself.
Mark on 28 Mar 2008 at 10:03 pm #
The Shack is a wonderful story of Man meeting God. It is based on the New Testament. The author William Young spoke at our church. Mr. Young is a God fearing man, the son of a minister, and feels the book was written under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. I agree. This is a fresh look at Our Creator. There has been a great deal of guilt, and control games created by organized religion that has nothing to do with Christ, or The Good News. We need to rethink our beliefs and rediscover a God who is creative, loving and liberating .
Max on 28 Mar 2008 at 10:41 pm #
We need to return to the Original, not reinvent or redefine God.
We need to respect the Fathers and Martyrs of the Church and hold to what they taught. Of course, this is the age of apostasy…
2Ti 4:3 “For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will HEAP UP for themselves teachers; and THEY WILL TURN THEIR EARS AWAY FROM THE TRUTH AND BE TURNED ASIDE TO FABLES.”
How true this is today. Christian teachers everywhere teaching heresy… and fables and fiction books are more popular than the holy writings of the Church Fathers… how long will the Lord endure this?
Diana on 01 Apr 2008 at 4:27 pm #
Thank you to all the clear-thinking Bible students who evaluated this book against the TRUTH in the Word of God. Too often, it’s the other way around. We must be careful to NOT judge the Bible by our experiences, but judge our experiences by the Word of God which is the only REALITY. And yes, it might seem narrow-minded to think the right way is narrow, but didn’t Jesus say that???? To be accused of narrow-mindedness is actually a compliment to the serious follower of God who actually studies the Word seriously and measures all of life’s experiences against it. Beware of the broad way… it’s the way of destruction. Matthew 7:13-29 is a passage that would benefit all to read… it’s Jesus speaking. May our ears be open and alert to our LORD and Savior and closed to the enemy’s enticements. The Word also says that Satan can appear as an angel of light - beware! He doesn’t appear to us with pitchfork and horns!!! And the Word also says: “Mat 24:24 For false Christs and false prophets will arise, and they will show great signs and wonders so as to deceive and lead astray, if possible, even the elect (God’s chosen ones).
Mat 24:25 See, I have warned you beforehand.” So, whatever you choose to do or not to do, do it prayerfully and with the authority of the Scriptures and clear leading of God who will never violate or contradict the Scriptures. May God give all of us wisdom! God’s Word also tells us all we have to do is ASK for wisdom (believing) and it will be given us. ASK.
Leslie on 01 Apr 2008 at 5:06 pm #
Thanks Diana! Good comments. Saying that we are narrow as a negative is silly. It’s like saying that to be devoted to one person in marriage is silly. At any rate, as a black woman, I do wonder how anyone can agree that this book is so wonderful when God is represented as a stereotypical “Aunt Jemima” type. This image is considered negative among black Americans, and is quite offensive. So, for those of you who are thinking that this book makes a good representation of the God of the Bible, I say think again. God is not divisive and this portrayal truly is. I am understating just how offensive this really is.
Diana on 01 Apr 2008 at 6:44 pm #
You are right, Leslie! I never thought of the negative of the “Aunt Jemima” either! Forgive me. The truth is, there is NO WAY that anyone can “put God in a Box” or describe Him… He has NEVER been seen except through Jesus and so to even attempt to describe Him is a futile waste of time and (maybe) a bit arrogant, though I don’t think William Young meant to be. It’s just a good thing that God loves us and knows that we are but clay. I pray for protection for all the hearts who have read it and are reading it - that God will reveal TRUTH to them about the book and about Himself.
Diana on 02 Apr 2008 at 7:06 pm #
When someone claims that because a book brought them back to God, or made them feel good, therefore it must be a good book and a true representation of God, they are deluded! (An extra-marital affair might make us feel good, too… does that make it right? Stealing something and getting away with it might make us feel pretty good, but does that make it right? The warm water made the froggie feel better, but as it got hotter without his notice, too late he found the danger). We should never measure something by our experiences… or how things make us “feelâ€â€¦ all of life should be measured ONLY by the Truth. A Bible-believing Christian should know that.
breeana on 06 Jun 2008 at 2:42 pm #
This book is Crazy! Did not like it at al! God is not a woman nor is the Holy Spirit! Jesus is not a wimp either! Jesus kickd Satan’s but and took the keys from him!Remember? My goodness people!
JosephMadre on 17 Jun 2008 at 6:40 pm #
having earned a theology degree from a highly reputable christian institution, might i be the first to point out the obvious, but perhaps, unknown. the Biblical interpretations of theologians run the spectrum of opinions, and these come from so-called Biblical experts, who know the Scriptures far better than most.
some of you point to the Bible and only the Bible, and that’s all well and grand, except that you obviously read this book, much to your chagrin. this would lead me to believe that you have also read other books of a Christian nature, which contradicts your Bible-only demands.
the fact of the matter is that reading is one activity of many we use to be informed, moved, and challenged. God is found not only in the Bible, but in the world around us, whether in the testimony of creation, or art, or any number of things that point us to the Divine. if this book helps people do such a thing, then it has served its purpose. surely few believe Jesus is an actual lion, as c.s. lewis portrayed in his narnia series, and i would challenge anyone to condemn the apologetic work lewis accomplished throughout his life.
by the sound of many of these posts, many planks need removed from the eyelids. and these sentiments are the very reason Christianity of this kind is growing obsolete and ineffective, for it is reminiscent of the judgment and accusations thrown around by the pharisees and saducees, groups Jesus clearly opposed. Truth is found in the Spirit, not in the letter of the law.
pl hendricks on 18 Jun 2008 at 10:06 am #
Bless you and WELL SAID.
I have chosen not to respond to all the narrow-mindedness since I posted earlier because I could not put into words what you just did. I know all who have posted their dislike for The Shack are most likely wonderful people who want to set the world straight with “religion”. They are only doing what they feel is best and right so please forgive me for being so impatient with your opinions of The Shack. I know it’s fiction. I know it’s not in exact sync with the Bible, but that’s just it–IT’S NOT THE BIBLE nor is it trying to be!
I have heard so many precious testimonies from people who have experienced what you just wrote about, Joseph. They are all very aware that this is FICTION yet DOES present new and different avenues to gain a concept of how real and gracious and how full of mercy God is…how real the TRINITY is and how available The Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit is and always will be to have a relationship with us…
His love is the only true unconditional, eternal love…in spite of our weaknesses and failures.
Thank you, Joseph.
Blessings.
Diana on 18 Jun 2008 at 11:13 am #
Theological degrees do not impress me - just as the Pharisees and Scribes who thought they knew better than the average guy just because of their learned knowledge. What does impress me is the deep desire to follow Jesus at all costs - true descipleship. I object to the book because it encourages a growth in experiences rather than a growth in truth. Jesus said we will worship in spirit and in truth. And He said the way IS narrow - not wide. So, yes, I may be a bit “cautious” as to what I read, because I am aware that in the last days many deceivers will come and try to lead many astray… you can miss a target by a fraction of an inch and you’ve missed the target. Satan can appear as an angel of light and so he can make us “feel good” with a “new age” kind of phylosophy, but I’d rather beware (as the Bible so often warns us) and err on the side of truth than to get caught up in a “little white lie” that has the potential to lead me astray further from the narrow path. However, I do NOT condemn those who want to read such fiction - that is totally up to the individual. I read lots of Christian fiction and don’t find any problem with most of it. But the Spirit within me just seemed to indicate that this was not a book for me. And all the other fiction I’ve read was still based on truth. This one is not based on truth. For example in one discussion with the “father”, the “father” said, “That’s why I sent Jesus - to reconcile myself to the world.” Well, that one statement was a HUGE red light to me. God did not need to be reconciled to US! This may sound like a small thing to others, but it makes it sound like God is the one who has either sinned, or at the very least been mistaken and now needs to be reconciled back to the world. This brings God down to our level and we are in danger when we view God as a God who makes mistakes or even sins. Why haven’t any of the theological masters mentioned this huge blunder? This statement is not only fiction, it’s a LIE and NOT the truth. If someone reads this book and not the Bible, they will have a totally wrong picture of our God and Father. This one statement in the book offended me more than any thing else. It is a huge misrepresentation of who our great Father’ character. The Lion in The Chronicles never misrepresents Jesus’ character, and the Bible even refers to Jesus as the Lion of Judah, so even that characterization is inline with Scripture. So, the differences in literature may be subtle, but they are so VERY clear if you know the Word. And the “traditional church” is moving in the direction of the “new age movement” more and more as time draws to a close, so beware - beware of the subtle attempts of the enemy to move us away from the truth. And pray ALWAYS that God’s Spirit will guide you and give you wisdom - the Word says we can pray for wisdom and it WILL be given to us. In these last days we need more wisdom than ever before. May God give us all His wisdom and an agape love for each other and a DEEP DESIRE for HIS TRUTH IN THE WORD. The very fact that this book has stirred up dissension should tell us something about whether or not it’s a good book to read.
JosephMadre on 18 Jun 2008 at 3:21 pm #
if it’s any consolation diana, i’m unimpressed with my theology degree as well, though i’d do it again. seeing the wide array of disagreement and divisiveness among leading theologians created more havoc for my own faith than i was prepared to address. but i did address it. i wrestled. i struggled for solid ground as my head and my heart battled. what this struggle produced was a simplified faith, and a simplified purpose of love, service, and compassion.
i’ll let those with more time on their hands than i argue over doctrines and interpretations. as for me, i have Jesus to follow, and my life to live. and the purpose of my life, or anyone else’s for that matter, is quite simple … people, and relationships. it’s an idea this book reiterated effectively, among other things. for when we allow the Spirit to work, we are, indeed, God’s eyes, ears, mouth, and often most importantly, arms, whether lending a helping hand or throwing our arms around another without a word. from the janitor buffing the tiles to the corporate head, we are all given the opportunity to share this Divine gift of the Spirit. it’s a beautiful thing, and a gift i cherish. i, me, this broken human gets the chance to share God’s love with others, to be God’s vessel to those around me. awesome! humbling. and that, THAT, is what brings a tear to my eye, and a lump to my throat, that despite my failings and inadequacies, God wants to use me. can you imagine?!
judgment and condemnation take so much energy, truly. and who, among us, is worthy to sit in that seat? one of my faves comes from the OT, in that “man looks at the outward appearance, but God looks at the heart.” thank goodness, cuz i look like a bum more often than not.
since Jesus’ ascension, the ‘end times’ have been at hand, so please don’t allow that looming conclusion to distract you from the present opportunities, nor feed the cynicism and distrust. if anything, let it inspire you to open your arms wider to those around you.
and concerning the dissension surrounding this book, well, all i can say is, the Biblical formation and canonization entailed far greater dissension from day one. it’s the very reason we’ve been blessed with the countless denominations that continue to bicker and judge each other behind closed doors, while putting on a smiling face to the world. the Message is understandably undermined.
let the theological points of contention be hashed out by those who have the time to sit at their big wooden desks, arguing over the number of angels who can fit on the head of a pin. aaah, academia.
as for me, i have a life to live, peple to see, and a world to change.
pl hendricks on 18 Jun 2008 at 8:58 pm #
Hey, Joseph…have you read “The Barbarian Way”? It’s awesome, too. Many of your comments brought the book to mind.
Yes and Amen to what you are saying…relationships…living out our slice of time and touching as many lives as we can with God’s love and the Message of Hope. Why else are we here?
I like how you put it: “as for me, I have a life to live, people to see, and a world to change…”
…for Him.
Diana on 18 Jun 2008 at 10:00 pm #
Joseph, I did not mean to imply that I was not impressed with you, but I have never been impressed with degrees or with “intelligence” because God’s Word tells us that He will confound the “wise” with the foolish things. But, I also believe like you, that we are to live out our life day by day serving our Master, but also looking forward to His coming, as instructed in the Bible. But, I firmly believe in not just leading someone to Christ, and leaving them at that point, but discipling them as well. This would include giving them the whole counsel of the Word of God, which would include the many MANY warnings in the Bible. Have you ever noticed how many warnings are in the Bible? God must have thought we needed to be warned often because His Word is full of warnings. I would direct you to this site (http://uncensoredsonofgod.wordpress.com/2008/04/24/what-the-bible-says-about-warnings/) to read a very interesting article on warnings. The gospel is simple, but not always easy to live. Just read some of the accounts of the “Voice of the Martyrs” from around the world. I do not discount what you have said, but I DO think there is more to “changing the world” than just a “simplified purpose of love, service and compassion”. All of that must be rooted in Truth and if there is someone or something disturbing that love, service and compassion in the body, it needs to be defended and overcome, else why would we need armor (Eph. 6). I believe everything you said is true, but I believe it is deeper and more to it… (i.e. love without truth is licenciousness, service without love based in truth is “as sounding brass”, and what is compassion for your brother or sister if you allow them to slip into compromise or untruths without warning them? Is that agape love or true compassion? Our version of love is so often thought of as “warm fuzzies”, but giving the truth to someone (in love) is the greatest form of love that one can give. The truth of the gospel is that we ARE sinners and that Jesus paid for that sin, but the minute we accept that, the enemy is working hard to steal it away from us… hence the many warnings in the Bible. It is through constant vigilence that we guard the treasure within us and be “overcomers” to the end. We need to be warned (cuz we’re dumb sheep) constantly. A great portion of Paul’s, Peter’s, James’, Jude’s, and John’s writings were overflowing with warnings and exhortations to diligently guard what has been entrusted to us and to beware of compromise, false prophets, wolves in sheeps’ clothing, false Christs, etc. And the N.T. tells us that the O.T. is there for our example - good and bad (to warn us). Should we not be warning others? To read the Bible and only see the “rosey”, easy parts is to miss MOST of the Bible’s “whole counsel”.
As for the “end times” being a distraction for me, nothing could be further from the truth. I feel even more urgency as the days go by to share Jesus with people and pray for the unsaved and to do His work BECAUSE I know the prophecies about His coming again. Right now, today, all prophecies are fulfilled in order for the Rapture to happen at any time. And I don’t want anyone to be left out. So, rather than distracting me, it propels me on. I am not cynical in spiritual matters, but I do have a certain amount of healthy distrust in everything that is said in Jesus’ name - just like the Berean’s who took everything they heard to the Word of God to test it’s integrity against the Word of God. That’s the kind of faith I want and God has been faithful to give me that kind of faith. I am not judging anyone… but I do choose to judge the truth or compromise of the truth in everything I read. And that’s another thing we are encouraged to do in the Word of God - to judge false and true teaching. In Matt. 7, the first verse says not to judge lest you be judged… yet in verse 15 of the same chapter, we are told to “B…
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Diana on 18 Jun 2008 at 10:05 pm #
(cont) “Beware of “false prophets who come in sheep’s clothing…” . It goes on to say we will know them by their fruits. So, how do we do that without judging what is false and what is true? I would submit that if you do a word study on judging in the first verse, you’ll find it means something akin to condemning (God’s job). But we ARE to judge the false prophets among us. Jesus says in verse 24 of that same chapter: “Therefore everyone who hears these words of Mine and acts upon them may be compared to a wise man who built his house upon the rock.” So, you see, we ARE to “judge” (discern) truth from error and false prophets from true ones. Again, may we be wise stewards of what has been entrusted to us and use it to love, serve and have compassion on one another and on the world around us. May we be discerning so that we won’t compromise our gift of faith. May we all be overcomers until the day of His return.
Thank you for the dialogue on this. It’s healthy to be able to discuss truth with our brothers and sisters in love.
JosephMadre on 19 Jun 2008 at 9:20 am #
another favorite quote of mine comes from st. francis of assisi, who said, “preach the Gospel at all times, and when necessary, use words.” amen to that.
and no, i haven’t read the barbarian way, but i’ll certainly look into it. thanks for the dialogue … always thought-provoking.
ejmlts on 19 Jun 2008 at 3:18 pm #
What an interesting dialogue that’s formed about this book…JosephMadre,
your comments exactly expressed some things I felt, so thanks!
Diana, I do agree with you that if you believe that something is wrong, then you should speak
up about it, but on the other hand, not everything that we feel, think and believe
is wrong, really is (which can be unsettling to realize quite frankly). Our emotions are a reflection of where our heart is (which is not always aligned with God’s Spirit, although also within). I think Young
brought this up in the book at some point. In any case, I just wanted to say
that your interpretation of the reconciliation conversation in the book was
completely different from my interpretation of it. I interpreted it as meaning that
God loves us so much that He sent Jesus to reconcile US to Himself, not the
other way around…we are the ones that fell short, not God (and I do believe this was Young’s point). And although we didn’t deserve for Him to send Jesus to reconcile us to Himself, He did it
anyway because of His unconditional love for us. Unfathomable! That is just a
small example of how 2 people loving and striving to serve and reflect the very
same God can interpret the same words differently. I don’t want to get into a theological
discussion about it, but I just wanted to point out that we each have our own
“glasses” through which we read and interpret writings (including the Bible, hence
the many denominations in the church, blech).
I had quietly been praying for some time for God to reveal Himself to me more
and more, and not too long after, He very clearly brought this book to me (and
please, no comments from anyone about how it was really the devil trying to
deceive me :-)). He used this book to reveal some incredible truths to me about
Himself, none of which contradicted the Bible. In fact, He confirmed the day after I finished teh book, with a Bible verse, the truth that touched me the most deeply in the book (the part about
His ability and desire to redeem humanity). No, this book is not the only place I could have found
that, and yes, I know all of His truths are in the Bible also, but in His infinite wisdom and
compassion, The Shack is what He used to graciously show me some powerful
truths. The fact that He chose to use this book to reveal some truths
about Himself to me doesn’t reflect Young, or the infallibility of the book, it mostly
reflects where I am right now in my life and the way (language, context, etc.)
that I was most likely to hear from God right now. Just as you wouldn’t use
SAT words to speak to a 4 year old with, God in His love uses what we’ll
understand based on where we are to speak to us with. God is big. A severe
understatement, but no words will ever do that truth justice. He can use absolutely
anything to speak to us through, and because of His amazing grace and
compassion, He does and will continue to. I trust Him to sift the chaff (untruths) from the
wheat (truths) in whatever I come into contact with. If He can create the world,
and reign over all, then certainly He can do that if I ask Him to.
Diana on 19 Jun 2008 at 5:07 pm #
ejmits, Thank you for your kind comments. But about the reconciliation of God to people… it was not my interpretation of what the book said - it is exactly what the book said. I don’t have a copy of it any longer, but there was no mistake and no interpretation needed… the words were right from his book… about Jesus coming to reconcile God to the world again, rather than the other way ’round. I agree that God’s Spirit can help us sift through the chaff and the wheat. He is faithful to do that for us, knowing that we are but clay.
Shauna on 27 Jun 2008 at 10:46 am #
People…please wake up!!! Can you not see right through this?! Where is the reverence of the holy trinity? Open your eyes and execrcise some discernment!! Even the forward was misleading…causing folks to ponder…”hmmm, was this based on a true story?” From the very beginning I got negative vibes from this book. It breaks my heart, but the biblical prophecy outlining the fact that even the “elect” will be deceived is unfolding right before our eyes. Remember, that Satan can take something evil and make it look sugary sweet…don’t look at this through rose-colored glasses. I urge you to be more perceptive than that. Some of the previous reflections from commentators did a terrific job highlighting the deception of this book. Please prayerfully consider the contents rather than immediately accepting it as a beautiful portrayal of Christ’s love….for example…comparing an Indian legend (entrenched in eastern mysticism and totally bogus) to the true events and precious love of Christ’s sacrifice on the cross?? This book is not at all edifying, accurate, or glorifying to God.
Diana on 27 Jun 2008 at 4:29 pm #
Thank you, Shauna! You have encouraged my heart today… there are others who refuse to compromise the Truth! Compromises don’t come in such contrasts that they are easily recognized - it DOES take discernment…. it just takes small steps to get us so far from the truth (eventually) that we no longer recognize it.
May your tribe increase 100 fold, Shauna!!!
JosephMadre on 27 Jun 2008 at 8:44 pm #
i have a sneaking suspicion we will all be very surprised to see who “makes the cut” when all the dust settles. it’s gonna be great!