Comments on: The Evangelical Epidemic of Theological Accountability and Discipline http://www.reclaimingthemind.org/blog/2007/09/the-evangelical-epidemic-of-theological-accountability-and-discipline/ Making Theology Accessible Sun, 14 Mar 2010 11:32:23 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: David http://www.reclaimingthemind.org/blog/2007/09/the-evangelical-epidemic-of-theological-accountability-and-discipline/comment-page-1/#comment-3227 David Mon, 13 Oct 2008 15:53:01 +0000 http://www.reclaimingthemind.org/devblog/2007/09/06/the-evangelical-epidemic-of-theological-accountability-and-discipline/#comment-3227 I have just stumbled over this blog (I know it's more than a year old) and have thoroughly enjoyed the discusssion. I have followed some of the other blogs and really appreciate the comments of many of your regulars. They show much insight and thought about the subject at hand. I just wanted to mention a point I picked up recently while reading Emil Brunner's, The Mediator. In the introductory material you states a case for the purpose of theology in the church. He places theology as a fence or a hedge around what can legitimately be called Christian teaching. While we attempt to fence in the least amount of territory, there is always a degree of uncertainty, at least this side of heaven. With a correct understanding of biblical truth we can include both Calvinists and Armenians while excluding the new Messiah seen on the Today Show. I have just stumbled over this blog (I know it’s more than a year old) and have thoroughly enjoyed the discusssion. I have followed some of the other blogs and really appreciate the comments of many of your regulars. They show much insight and thought about the subject at hand.

I just wanted to mention a point I picked up recently while reading Emil Brunner’s, The Mediator. In the introductory material you states a case for the purpose of theology in the church. He places theology as a fence or a hedge around what can legitimately be called Christian teaching. While we attempt to fence in the least amount of territory, there is always a degree of uncertainty, at least this side of heaven. With a correct understanding of biblical truth we can include both Calvinists and Armenians while excluding the new Messiah seen on the Today Show.

]]> By: Blue Collar Theology 9: C. Michael Patton on Theological Accountability « Provocations & Pantings http://www.reclaimingthemind.org/blog/2007/09/the-evangelical-epidemic-of-theological-accountability-and-discipline/comment-page-1/#comment-3226 Blue Collar Theology 9: C. Michael Patton on Theological Accountability « Provocations & Pantings Mon, 17 Sep 2007 07:23:49 +0000 http://www.reclaimingthemind.org/devblog/2007/09/06/the-evangelical-epidemic-of-theological-accountability-and-discipline/#comment-3226 [...] the Parchment and Pen blog, C. Michael Patton recently wrote an excellent article entitled, “The Evangelical Epidemic of Theological Accountability and Discipline” in which he makes an excellent case why (albeit tacitly) theological education must [...] [...] the Parchment and Pen blog, C. Michael Patton recently wrote an excellent article entitled, “The Evangelical Epidemic of Theological Accountability and Discipline” in which he makes an excellent case why (albeit tacitly) theological education must [...]

]]> By: Lisa R http://www.reclaimingthemind.org/blog/2007/09/the-evangelical-epidemic-of-theological-accountability-and-discipline/comment-page-1/#comment-3225 Lisa R Fri, 07 Sep 2007 18:26:43 +0000 http://www.reclaimingthemind.org/devblog/2007/09/06/the-evangelical-epidemic-of-theological-accountability-and-discipline/#comment-3225 PS - that was not a paid advertisement : - ) PS – that was not a paid advertisement : – )

]]> By: Lisa R http://www.reclaimingthemind.org/blog/2007/09/the-evangelical-epidemic-of-theological-accountability-and-discipline/comment-page-1/#comment-3224 Lisa R Fri, 07 Sep 2007 18:23:37 +0000 http://www.reclaimingthemind.org/devblog/2007/09/06/the-evangelical-epidemic-of-theological-accountability-and-discipline/#comment-3224 Mike K, This is where I would put my plug in for the Theology Program because it really is designed with the average Joe in mind. Some people run or tune out, when they think "theology" but I think, no hope, you would find it quite user-friendly. I would encourage you and your wife to check it out. Mike K,

This is where I would put my plug in for the Theology Program because it really is designed with the average Joe in mind. Some people run or tune out, when they think “theology” but I think, no hope, you would find it quite user-friendly. I would encourage you and your wife to check it out.

]]> By: Michael K http://www.reclaimingthemind.org/blog/2007/09/the-evangelical-epidemic-of-theological-accountability-and-discipline/comment-page-1/#comment-3223 Michael K Fri, 07 Sep 2007 17:02:48 +0000 http://www.reclaimingthemind.org/devblog/2007/09/06/the-evangelical-epidemic-of-theological-accountability-and-discipline/#comment-3223 Vance - I was specifically responding your Post# 14. Like - From the Balcony I too was blown away with some of the ideas in this post. Humor aside I agree with your last paragraph. For my wife sitting in a theology class would be like sitting in a class room with the Peanuts gang. All she'd hear from the teacher would be "waa waa waa", and this is a woman who is an HR Director for a large international firm. I've asked her numerous times if the issue for her is one of not really wanting to understand or an inability to understand. She's responded every time that theological discussions simply fly over her head. Sigh As someone who's done years of Sr. High Sunday School teaching I believe it to be absolutely essential for a Christian to have a basic level of theological understanding. I believe we've achieved that basic level in our church be doing an exhaustive study of the Westminster Catechism. But I have to say the courses offered from this ministry are intriguing. (btw I just came across this site for the first time today so I'm still soaking in all the possibilities) Vance – I was specifically responding your Post# 14.
Like – From the Balcony I too was blown away with some of the ideas in this post.

Humor aside I agree with your last paragraph. For my wife sitting in a theology class would be like sitting in a class room with the Peanuts gang. All she’d hear from the teacher would be “waa waa waa”, and this is a woman who is an HR Director for a large international firm. I’ve asked her numerous times if the issue for her is one of not really wanting to understand or an inability to understand. She’s responded every time that theological discussions simply fly over her head. Sigh

As someone who’s done years of Sr. High Sunday School
teaching I believe it to be absolutely essential for a Christian to have a basic level of theological understanding. I believe we’ve achieved that basic level in our church be doing an exhaustive study of the Westminster Catechism. But I have to say the courses offered from this ministry are intriguing.

(btw I just came across this site for the first time today so I’m still soaking in all the possibilities)

]]> By: Vance http://www.reclaimingthemind.org/blog/2007/09/the-evangelical-epidemic-of-theological-accountability-and-discipline/comment-page-1/#comment-3222 Vance Fri, 07 Sep 2007 16:27:55 +0000 http://www.reclaimingthemind.org/devblog/2007/09/06/the-evangelical-epidemic-of-theological-accountability-and-discipline/#comment-3222 Ah, Michael K, you give the lie to your claim to "dullness" in your very post. You are merely impersonating joe six-pack! :) Seriously, though, I think about my grandmother, who is 83 now and does not know ecclesiology from epistemology and I don't really know that her spiritual life would be much improved by that enlightenment. I think we all should move forward toward the highest level of knowledge and understanding as we can (and have been advocating such study for years, so it is hard to even play devil's advocate here), but for some, that level will not be very far along. As a thought experiment, put your church congregation in your mental eye and let it wander over the various folks you know in the pew. Now, for each, ask yourself how they would react to the type of training involved in, say, seminary level courses. Many would respond wonderfully and should be encouraged to seek out programs like the Theology Program. Others would react better to solid teaching in an adult Sunday School class. Ah, Michael K, you give the lie to your claim to “dullness” in your very post. You are merely impersonating joe six-pack! :)

Seriously, though, I think about my grandmother, who is 83 now and does not know ecclesiology from epistemology and I don’t really know that her spiritual life would be much improved by that enlightenment. I think we all should move forward toward the highest level of knowledge and understanding as we can (and have been advocating such study for years, so it is hard to even play devil’s advocate here), but for some, that level will not be very far along.

As a thought experiment, put your church congregation in your mental eye and let it wander over the various folks you know in the pew. Now, for each, ask yourself how they would react to the type of training involved in, say, seminary level courses.

Many would respond wonderfully and should be encouraged to seek out programs like the Theology Program. Others would react better to solid teaching in an adult Sunday School class.

]]> By: From The Balcony http://www.reclaimingthemind.org/blog/2007/09/the-evangelical-epidemic-of-theological-accountability-and-discipline/comment-page-1/#comment-3221 From The Balcony Fri, 07 Sep 2007 15:17:53 +0000 http://www.reclaimingthemind.org/devblog/2007/09/06/the-evangelical-epidemic-of-theological-accountability-and-discipline/#comment-3221 Michael This blog post blew me away and brought out the deepest concerns of my heart for the church in our day and age. Thank you for expressing it so beautifully. Michael
This blog post blew me away and brought out the deepest concerns of my heart for the church in our day and age. Thank you for expressing it so beautifully.

]]> By: Michael K http://www.reclaimingthemind.org/blog/2007/09/the-evangelical-epidemic-of-theological-accountability-and-discipline/comment-page-1/#comment-3220 Michael K Fri, 07 Sep 2007 12:38:52 +0000 http://www.reclaimingthemind.org/devblog/2007/09/06/the-evangelical-epidemic-of-theological-accountability-and-discipline/#comment-3220 As one of the duller knives in the drawer I wanted to comment about the level of theological study Joe six-pack should be expected to comprehend as opposed to pastoral staff. While theological vocabulary may be a burden and escape me at times, the concepts and the exegesis used to formulate them are usually understood. I may ask a question or two for clarification but that's all it usually takes. For the believer, I'm convinced that the Holy Spirit is extremely active in expanding ones level of discernment; as needed. Subjects and ideas that were meaningless to me 5 years ago can now seem obviously apparent. Please keep in mind that the dullest knife in the drawer sometimes simply requires a little polishing. :-) As one of the duller knives in the drawer I wanted to comment about the level of theological study Joe six-pack should be expected to comprehend as opposed to pastoral staff.

While theological vocabulary may be a burden and escape me at times, the concepts and the exegesis used to formulate them are usually understood. I may ask a question or two for clarification but that’s all it usually takes. For the believer, I’m convinced that the Holy Spirit is extremely active in expanding ones level of discernment; as needed. Subjects and ideas that were meaningless to me 5 years ago can now seem obviously apparent.

Please keep in mind that the dullest knife in the drawer sometimes simply requires a little polishing. :-)

]]> By: Lisa R http://www.reclaimingthemind.org/blog/2007/09/the-evangelical-epidemic-of-theological-accountability-and-discipline/comment-page-1/#comment-3219 Lisa R Fri, 07 Sep 2007 10:44:21 +0000 http://www.reclaimingthemind.org/devblog/2007/09/06/the-evangelical-epidemic-of-theological-accountability-and-discipline/#comment-3219 Sorry Nick, I should have read your comments a little more carefully since you were talking about others and not yourself. I do encounter that as well and sometimes its just downright tough to convince a person that has put so much weight on experience that disciplined study has to be there as well. When I was really wrestling with the continuation of sign gifts, I wanted to hear the perspective of friend of mine who has an M.Div and serves on the pastoral staff at a pentacostal based church. I wanted to hear her exegesis but what I got was a discussion on experience. Go figure! I will also add to this mix, how important training is for discernment against distorted teaching. Jude tells us it creeps in unnoticed. And it will do so as long as the Joe six-pack in the pew is taught that it’s ok for him to just love God. There’s a whole lot of funny stuff mixed in with some truth but a little leaven leavens the whole lump. And being tossed to and fro with every wind of doctrine does not bring credibility to our faith or honors Christ. Just my 2 cents. Sorry Nick, I should have read your comments a little more carefully since you were talking about others and not yourself. I do encounter that as well and sometimes its just downright tough to convince a person that has put so much weight on experience that disciplined study has to be there as well. When I was really wrestling with the continuation of sign gifts, I wanted to hear the perspective of friend of mine who has an M.Div and serves on the pastoral staff at a pentacostal based church. I wanted to hear her exegesis but what I got was a discussion on experience. Go figure!

I will also add to this mix, how important training is for discernment against distorted teaching. Jude tells us it creeps in unnoticed. And it will do so as long as the Joe six-pack in the pew is taught that it’s ok for him to just love God. There’s a whole lot of funny stuff mixed in with some truth but a little leaven leavens the whole lump. And being tossed to and fro with every wind of doctrine does not bring credibility to our faith or honors Christ. Just my 2 cents.

]]> By: C Michael Patton http://www.reclaimingthemind.org/blog/2007/09/the-evangelical-epidemic-of-theological-accountability-and-discipline/comment-page-1/#comment-3198 C Michael Patton Fri, 07 Sep 2007 02:53:02 +0000 http://www.reclaimingthemind.org/devblog/2007/09/06/the-evangelical-epidemic-of-theological-accountability-and-discipline/#comment-3198 Well, such is the state of the religious way of thinking. I blame Kant. Well, such is the state of the religious way of thinking. I blame Kant.

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