I believe 616 could be describing hexadecimal code. 6 hexa would identify the code and 16 would be the numbering system. Rev. 13:18 “for it is the number of a man” could also be translated as the number of mankind. There is a revised metric system called hexadecimal metric system abbreviated internationally SMH for: “système métrique hexadécimal”. SMH could be used to change our whole measurement system. http://hexadecimal.florencetime.net/Hexadecimal_metric_system.htm#Links

…the authority of a man. If Hitler couldn’t make everyone believe in his fascism then he could still make them obey.

In Apocalypse 13, 15 it says that it was permitted that life should be given to the image of the beast that it could both speak and cause for people to be killed who wouldn’t worship the beast. This was the advent of motion pictures and the Nazi propaganda films. People went along with it all, and anyone who wouldn’t was an enemy of the state. The things that the Nazis did should make it obvious that this was the beast’s dark kingdom.

Apocalypse 12, 7-9 tells of a great battle in heaven between Michael and his angels, which represent the USAAF, and the dragon and his angels: the Luftwaffe. The dragon symbolizes the army of the beast, which gives the beast its own authority. That means that the army supported the fascist state and made possible its evil rule. Without it the beast would have had no power.

The events depicted in Revelations, when one understands the meaning of the various symbols, corresponds to the first and second world wars, the restoration of Israel, the cold war, and apparently the second coming of Christ is still to come..

The number of the beast is the number of a man. This means that the beast’s number is calculated as is a man’s number. A man’s number consists of three digits; the first is the number of the letters in his name added together and the digits added together until arriving at a single digit. The other two numbers are his date of birth reduced to a single digit, and the day of the week of his birthday.

The beast is not a man. The beast is a symbol of a country imposing tyranny through war over the whole world, or nearly the whole world. Seven countries have done that throughout history since Daniel. These were Babylon, Persia, Media, Greece, Egypt/Syria, Rome, and Germany. Each of the seven heads represents one of these countries. An angel said to John in Apocalypse 17, 10 that five had fallen, one is and the other had not yet come. The one that existed at the time was Rome. The one to come was Germany. This was the head that had the wound of the sword and was killed but rose again with its deadly wound healed.

Germany started World War 1 on August 1, 1914. On this date Germany became the beast. The digits of this date add up to 6 and it was a Saturday, the 6th day. The official name of Germany in German was ‘Deutsches Reich’ from 1871-1945. The letters of this name, using the 30-letter German alphabet, add up to 6. ‘Deutsches Reich’ is therefore the name of the beast, ‘born’ on August 1, 1914. This is the answer to the riddle of the 666.

Germany rose again restored and re-armed to launch World War 2. This beast made everyone worship the first beast, the glorious military heritage of the Fatherland. This nationalism was perhaps more effective motivation than the personalities of the Kaiser or Hitler, but swearing allegiance to either Germany or Hitler was to put it or him before God. This is what is meant by the mark of the beast in Apocalypse 13, 16,17. The forehead represents the mind, or belief; the right hand represents the will or the choice,…

Great to hear from you, Anthony! Yeah, that was a great day. And by the way, thanks so much for putting up the CSNTM team on their way out of that unnamed eastern European country recently! They thoroughly enjoyed the time with you!

I was with Dan in Oxford when we viewed this manuscript.

As a pastor, I have less time to pursue my interest in TC than I would like as I consider it a lesser priority. My knowledge is woeful. Yet that day remains a highlight of my life and I ‘m not sure I fully comprehend why.

I’m not sure I’m particularly fussed whether 616 or 666 is the original reading, nor was I at the time. Yet to be there was a moment that deeply affected me.

Amongst those Christians I regularly fellowship with, the concept of “Christian experience” is one that might not be so broad as to immediately bring to mind that which I experienced this particular day, yet it was a sobering experience that had huge impact on my life. And again, I’m not sure I fully understand why.

No assistance to this discussion, I am aware of that. Just a few rambling thoughts as I found this blog.

Hello Dan,

Glad to see your blog. We have a common friend via the internet in Maestroh,
Jay Barker, or whatever handle he uses here. He has spoken most highly of
you. Because of his influence, I purchased your Text Book on Greek.
It may be a while before I get in to it since I am still going through Mounce’s
book.

I have been on a quest to better understand eschatology. And, of course,
I have read numerous authors from all sides of the issue.

At this point, I have ruled out Dispensationalism completely. I know that is
nearly anathema to the ears of many Professors at DTS and students too.
Having said that, I would like your take on the so-called internal evidences
for the pre 70 a.d. dating of the Book of Revelation. I believe whenever
the tribulation happens, past or future, the Church will be there.

As far as the 666 and 616, this seems to be huge evidence that is was
speaking of Nero. I think Demar, Gentry, and Sproul make some good points.

Blessings

YP

Thanks James… I’ll snack on them as I am able.

-steve

Greetings Steve Moore,

I’m glad to read that your appetite for New Testament textual criticism is whetted.
Allow me to put my brief introduction to the subject on the menu:
http://www.curtisvillechristian.org/TCGoals.html .

And for dessert, a summary of my approach to the textual criticism of the Gospels at
http://www.curtisvillechristian.org/TextHistory.html .

At http://www.curtisvillechristian.org/BasicTC.html you can find a variety of
links related to NT textual criticism. Chew thoroughly before swallowing anything.

Dr Wallace,

You’re absolutely correct that I missed every one of the items you enumerated. But, gives me something to go and learn about too… whet’s the proverbial appetite. ;^)

A class on TC would be great, so I’ll second Carrie’s request.

thanks,

-steve

Point well taken, Steve. I guess my sensitivity is to the issue that you are peering in at a conversation in which you have only partial knowledge. As James and I exchanged ideas, I kept wondering how many others had read Irenaeus’s chapter on the number of the beast, how many understood Irenaeus’s normal textual affinities, how many were even aware of the larger issues of external vs. internal evidence, how to weigh manuscripts, the nature of the early versions (translations into other languages) and the fact that all patristic writings need to be reconstructed since we don’t have the originals. In other words, the reason I felt this discussion was not as helpful to most readers of RMM is that there was too much preunderstanding that they were missing. It would be like walking into a third-year language class when you were a beginning. Thus, Carrie has a point: perhaps a basic course on textual criticism is called for…